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  #1861  
Old 07-05-2007, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GC4meNow
Lawsuit will make sure that "big wigs" will be facing subpoenia and will have to prove their "innocence" (or sanity!) under "oath"... now thats important for a sense of justice... no matter what the outcome... If nothing else it will satisfy the curiosity and clear this fog...
Have you been to any lawsuit before? From your post, it does not appears to be.

USCIS does not need to prove "innocence". The party that is initiating lawsuit needs to prove based on legal facts what harm was caused due to alleged wrongdoing. The onus is the party to prove.

If this case is so straightforward, why I don't see any lawyer taking up this case?

If AILF wins the case, then lawyers will say "we backed AILF and ready to take the credit", but if AILF loses, will they take up the blame or hide behind "AILF lost the case".

Regarding the quote -- We stand a chance if we fight the case, but we will lose 100% if we don't fight. This reminds me of Lotto ads on radio that says - You could win 1 million if we play, but definitely you will NOT win if you don't play. In both cases, tactically, the fact of chance of success is hidden.

Another thing to oberseve is that - ALF threat to sue has worked in past (see link - http://www.ailf.org/lac/lac_dol.shtml ) but it did not work this time. Why? Probably it needs a little more research.

Good Luck.

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  #1862  
Old 07-05-2007, 09:24 AM
xyz xyz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macaca
You miss all the shots that you don't take
Yes, in basketball game it is true. The team which does not take shots misses the shots. Nothing to loose for the team. In our case, USCIS will pull some of their scarce resources behind the law-suit and it may affect their main tasks of adjudicating applications and clearing the backlogs of petitions [EB applications itself are likely to run in 500K-700K as stated by others]. Please note that this agency is not federally funded, but it is funded by fees from petitions. All costs they will incur [ government attorneys' fees etc ] in this lawsuit will come from the fees collected. I am not against the law-suit but I prefer to see both sides of the coin before taking any side. I request the members to welcome the views which they do not agree on. The members should not shut others from voicing their views, just simply because they do not like those views.

Last edited by xyz; 07-05-2007 at 09:37 AM.
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  #1863  
Old 07-05-2007, 09:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xyz
Yes, in basketball game it is true. The team which does not take shots misses the shots. Nothing to loose for the team. In our case, USCIS will pull some of their scarce resources behind the law-suit and it may affect their main tasks of adjudicating applications and clearing the backlogs of petitions [EB applications itself are likely to run in 500K-700K as stated by others]. Please note that this agency is not federally funded, but it is funded by fees from petitions. All costs they will incur [ government attorneys' fees etc ] in this lawsuit will come from the fees collected. I am not against the law-suit but I prefer to see both sides of the coin before taking any side. I request the members to welcome the views which they do not agree on. The members should not shut others from voicing their views, just simply because they do not like those views.
@XYZ
It seems to me that you are waiting for AOS. What you said might be true and I don't want to go as far as calling you selfish but I hope you realize the amount of effort that many have had to go through due to this screw up. Folks had to reshedule their travels, drive far to get medical done (I drove 2 hours one way) I even heard of some who got married and we should just sit on our buns so already filled AOS goes through quicker?

Last edited by WhereIsTheCard; 07-05-2007 at 09:50 AM.
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  #1864  
Old 07-05-2007, 09:54 AM
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Default Limit the number of threads

Admin

Can we close all the thread ..its becoming tough to track the issues. Right now we need 3 thread only to cover the July fiasco , June trackers and misc. contributions and media drives and IV core announcements will be there always
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  #1865  
Old 07-05-2007, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by royus77
Admin

Can we close all the thread ..its becoming tough to track the issues. Right now we need 3 thread only to cover the July fiasco , June trackers and misc. contributions and media drives and IV core announcements will be there always
There will be thread bulletin during the middle of month with thread cut-off date. Any thread which was before that date will have a chance to be deleted!
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  #1866  
Old 07-05-2007, 09:57 AM
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Default Article in WSJ on July fiasco

Reversal Frustrates
Green-Card Applicants
By MIRIAM JORDAN
July 5, 2007; Page A2

The government's surprise offer, then abrupt reversal, of an opportunity for thousands of skilled foreign workers to obtain permanent residency in the U.S. highlights the problems of the overtaxed immigration system and the frenzy that results from a chance to apply for a green card.

The scramble has put tens of thousands of workers and their families in limbo after many of them and their employers spent thousands of dollars in hopes of securing permanent residency. It may result in a class-action lawsuit against the government by frustrated applicants.

The problem began on June 12 when the government seemed to open the door for thousands of foreign workers and their families to end the long wait to apply for a green card. That is when the State Department published a Visa Bulletin, which is a monthly notice closely watched by immigration attorneys and their clients because it determines who is eligible to file a green-card application the next month. The June bulletin announced that practically all skilled foreign workers who had been previously deemed eligible for an employer-sponsored visa could now take the final step of applying for a green card.

By law, the U.S. can issue about 140,000 employment-based green cards each year. Last year, the government fell short by about 10,000, despite the long waiting list; leftover visas cannot be rolled over to the next year. The June announcement aimed to prevent the visa slot from going to waste, according to a State Department spokeswoman.
[Green-Card Limbo]

The announcement was greeted with a mix of jubilation and panic by thousands of engineers, lab scientists and other high-skilled foreigners who had waited years for their place in line. Working ahead of a July 2 date for filing the application, intending immigrants rushed to gather documents, complete paperwork and obtain medical exams. Many of their dependents boarded planes for the U.S. to meet a requirement that all family members be present at the time of filing.

"The bulletin created a land rush among legal immigrants desperate to finalize their green-card applications," said Steve Miller, a Seattle-based immigration attorney.

Then, on July 2, the State Department issued an "update" that reversed the previous bulletin. It stated, effective immediately, there would be no further authorizations for employment-based cases. The U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services, which processes the applications, said it would instead simply process existing applications to meet this year's quota. "We already had sufficient applications pending without new applicants...," a spokesman said.

Mike Aytes, head of domestic operations for the USCIS, said all 147,141 employment-based green cards have now been issued for the year.

Write to Miriam Jordan at miriam.jordan@wsj.com
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  #1867  
Old 07-05-2007, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bigboy007
I dont think we can shy away our cause just becoz americans hate Immigration. Americans are exploited for hte cause of loss of workforce. All americans are immigrants. what ever it might be. I agree with constructive way but with media drive or even lawsuit you cant shy away for the fact that some ppl may not like it. Its not a good idea to keep silent at what USCIS does and i dont think we are their mercy after paying heavy fees.
Its funny how you are bashing Americans. Back where I come from there were riots and violence (shiv sena anybody) because people from one part of the SAME country were taking jobs there. American is very tolerant compared to many other countries, learn to appretiate that. And about US made up of immigrants, the same can be said about every country, humans originated in somewhere in Africa. If I was an American I wound't want to have someone who bad mouths me every time so adjust your attitude.

Last edited by WhereIsTheCard; 07-05-2007 at 10:06 AM.
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  #1868  
Old 07-05-2007, 10:12 AM
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FYI : thats not the issue in Pvt sector in india and truely i dont believe that humans originated only in africa. I trust my beliefs of how people orignated in india i dont want to get in to this but just to let you know.

And now i dont want to go back to support this. but to let u know once small joke for USA " Its land of liberty" but its no longer a land of liberty comparitively w.r.t. canada. when you compare with times.

i have seen this world and in many countries how govt respect skilled immigrants , you better know may be US is your first stop. i am here only becoz of work nothing a dime more.
__________________
** Please don't take this as a legal guidance or suggestion. I am only providing info that I am thinking right which might not be correct always **

Last edited by bigboy007; 07-05-2007 at 10:19 AM.
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  #1869  
Old 07-05-2007, 10:14 AM
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FYI i am not bashing americans please read my entire post before commenting. i said there is no need for us to shy away thinking americans will retaliate our efforts.**** with your attitude man !! you learn how to read messages and comment i dont have to learn from you how to behave.
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** Please don't take this as a legal guidance or suggestion. I am only providing info that I am thinking right which might not be correct always **
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  #1870  
Old 07-05-2007, 10:25 AM
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Default Why India is not included in the DV lottery??

Quote:
Originally Posted by gc_chahiye
the diversity visa is something I wish they either do away with or reduce the numbers and put that 50K into EB. It does not make sense to have so many of those numbers in a lottery, without caring about the needs of US employers or people already here who have possibly adopted a US lifestyle and spent 5,6,7 years in this country!

Nothing against these countries, but note that EB has a country-cap of 7% so allows only 9800 high-skilled immigrants who are already in the US and are sponsored by an employer. Now see the DV numbers per-country for 2006:

Nigeria: 10000
Egypt: 7500
Ukraine: 7205
Ethiopia: 7000
Bangladesh: 6000
Morocco: 5000
Ghana: 3000
Albania: 2000
Nepal: 1500

thats a lot of people who are being lottery-picked!

Does anybody know Why India is not included in the DV lottery??
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  #1871  
Old 07-05-2007, 10:28 AM
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This could mean some people would still recieve approvals,as they have some backlog at USCIS, I would like the attorneys to know the exact situation before they start the lawsuit.We cant sue on the basis of assumptions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vxg
Reversal Frustrates
Green-Card Applicants
By MIRIAM JORDAN
July 5, 2007; Page A2

The government's surprise offer, then abrupt reversal, of an opportunity for thousands of skilled foreign workers to obtain permanent residency in the U.S. highlights the problems of the overtaxed immigration system and the frenzy that results from a chance to apply for a green card.

The scramble has put tens of thousands of workers and their families in limbo after many of them and their employers spent thousands of dollars in hopes of securing permanent residency. It may result in a class-action lawsuit against the government by frustrated applicants.

The problem began on June 12 when the government seemed to open the door for thousands of foreign workers and their families to end the long wait to apply for a green card. That is when the State Department published a Visa Bulletin, which is a monthly notice closely watched by immigration attorneys and their clients because it determines who is eligible to file a green-card application the next month. The June bulletin announced that practically all skilled foreign workers who had been previously deemed eligible for an employer-sponsored visa could now take the final step of applying for a green card.

By law, the U.S. can issue about 140,000 employment-based green cards each year. Last year, the government fell short by about 10,000, despite the long waiting list; leftover visas cannot be rolled over to the next year. The June announcement aimed to prevent the visa slot from going to waste, according to a State Department spokeswoman.
[Green-Card Limbo]

The announcement was greeted with a mix of jubilation and panic by thousands of engineers, lab scientists and other high-skilled foreigners who had waited years for their place in line. Working ahead of a July 2 date for filing the application, intending immigrants rushed to gather documents, complete paperwork and obtain medical exams. Many of their dependents boarded planes for the U.S. to meet a requirement that all family members be present at the time of filing.

"The bulletin created a land rush among legal immigrants desperate to finalize their green-card applications," said Steve Miller, a Seattle-based immigration attorney.

Then, on July 2, the State Department issued an "update" that reversed the previous bulletin. It stated, effective immediately, there would be no further authorizations for employment-based cases. The U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services, which processes the applications, said it would instead simply process existing applications to meet this year's quota. "We already had sufficient applications pending without new applicants...," a spokesman said.

Mike Aytes, head of domestic operations for the USCIS, said all 147,141 employment-based green cards have now been issued for the year.

Write to Miriam Jordan at miriam.jordan@wsj.com

Last edited by delhiguy; 07-05-2007 at 10:30 AM.
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  #1872  
Old 07-05-2007, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pthoko
Does anybody know Why India is not included in the DV lottery??
If any country sends 'above' a certain threshold of immigrants over the past several years, then that country is not eligible for the dv lottery.

India is one of them.

http://travel.state.gov/pdf/DV_2008_Final.pdf

Last edited by Hewa; 07-05-2007 at 10:41 AM.
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  #1873  
Old 07-05-2007, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pthoko
Does anybody know Why India is not included in the DV lottery??
Because Indians have lots of other visas available. They can come through Family Basted immigration, H1B, L1, B1... there are other ways available.
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  #1874  
Old 07-05-2007, 11:04 AM
xyz xyz is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macaca
Litigation is performed by USCIS lawyers and not by USCIS employees processing GC applications. So, litigation will not effect speed of GC processing.

Litigation may lead to increase in application fees for future applicants. If you have not applied or your June application got rejected, will you avoid taking this shot that may increase fees for future applicants?
Agreed, USCIS lawyers but they are paid for fighting the lawsuits on behalf of USCIS from the fees collected. Who will be asked to depose? Who will provide the information/data to fight the lawsuit? If USCIS does not involve case certifying officers and other administrative staff for this kind of lawsuit, you are right.

Last edited by xyz; 07-05-2007 at 11:10 AM.
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  #1875  
Old 07-05-2007, 11:27 AM
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rajmehrotra will become famous soon enough rajmehrotra will become famous soon enough
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What has happened has happened. Maybe USCIS and/or DOS did goof up. Or maybe they really did want to reduce the backlog and use up all the available visas, and with all the good faith they could muster, worked themselves into a frenzy and on morning of July 2nd, they realized their blunder.

All the talk of lawsuits and class action, IMHO, is just a gravy train by the lawyers and for the lawyers. We, the 485 filers will just extras in their lush production. What kind of remedy do we expect? The Visa Bulletin is ex cathedra guidance, but subject to revision, even if there is no precedent for such revision. There is no law that spells out the formulation of the monthly Visa Bulletins. It is merely an administrative guidance tool, no different from a train schedule, with all of its implicit caveats.

Anyhow, hard as it is, we have to hunt for the silver lining in this episode. I think if this story got enough traction as a shining example of shoddy treatment of people who respect and follow the law, and contribute positively, in every sense of the word, to the well being of the United States, we will have it in play. Intervention from the Executive and Legislative branch could then be elicited. Individually, all of us should lay out our cases, respectfully and in good detail, to the Senators and Congressmen of our areas, to let them gauge the enormity of the problem at hand. This would be dream issue for the Senators and Congress people to attend to if it gains the critical mass. Doing whatever is required to right this wrong has no downside for any of them. They can even credit themselves for somehow rescuing a remedy out of the CIR fiasco. They can be the heroes here.

The New York Times and The Wall Street Journal have already run the story. We need to build up on this. Even the Lou Dobbs and law-and-order types in the public arena can be roped in on this one. After all, we are trying to immigrate the right way, by fastidiously following the law, and dropping significant chunks of dollars all around while doing so.

If our efforts lead to recapturing of unused prior-year visa numbers, a relaxation in per-country limits, a delay on the filing-fee increases, and perhaps some movement on the SKIL Bill, we will have a net gain.
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