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Administrator2
08-18-2014, 02:17 PM
We have received multiple inquiries about what is going on with the EB admin fixes. Rather than answering each message individually, here is our attempt to clear some air.

Apparently, there are some people posting online that a decision could soon be made on recapture of unused immigrant visas. This is not true. Recapture was briefly discussed sometime back but it was decided that recapture of unused visas cannot be done through administrative means. Same goes for exempting dependents. Things can always change, but just so you know, no such decision is pending on recapture this week.

For the sake of clarity, let us also share some important information about EAD for H-4 rule. This fix was already announced over 2 months back. USCIS/DHS is reviewing submitted comments to the notification. After the review of the comments is complete, DHS will issue final ruling. So it is just a matter of time. The decision for EAD for H-4 was already made some time back and no more decision making from the President of DHS is needed. DHS/USCIS is currently reviewing the comments and the final rule will be announced soon (no specific timeline available).

If it was possible within the existing framework of law, without a doubt we would have preferred more green cards, whichever means these green cards would come. However, at this time, that is not possible within the existing law. We have also asked for recapture of unused green cards and exempting dependents from numerical limits. But as it appears, these fixes cannot be done through Administrative method within the existing law. As it appears right now, recapture of unused green cards and exempting dependents from numerical limits will require Congressional action.

Therefore, our focus is on fixes that will help improve quality of life for EB applicants. Our fixes will allow everyone to live a free life and be able to do the things each one is potentially capable of doing. Our suggestions are focused on fixes that will allow EB immigrants to change jobs/employers after immigrant petition, clarity with what jobs one can change into, access to immigration (green card and H1/L1 application and decision notices) required to change job, not having to restart green card process after approval of I-140, long term EAD and AP so EB applicants and employers are not stressed out over receiving EAD renewals on time, and other such fixes.

We believe that these minor technical fixes will help improve the quality of life of over a million skilled immigrants and their families stuck in green card backlogs.

We are attempting to keep things clear as much possible for everyone waiting in EB backlogs. As Admin fix process unfolds, you will probably read all sorts of news/information online. For your own benefit, please filtering facts from fiction when consuming information available online.

Suva
08-18-2014, 03:32 PM
What would Obama do for illegals? If we see that he authorizes legal permit for illegals then we would ask on why he can't authorize recapture of visas.

Administrator2
08-18-2014, 04:03 PM
What would Obama do for illegals? If we see that he authorizes legal permit for illegals then we would ask on why he can't authorize recapture of visas.

Perhaps you did not read through my message or maybe I was not clear enough. I would request you to read through the message and see the positive aspects of it because there are plenty of them if you see through it.

Lets be respectful for the needs and gravity of the issue. Its easy to ask this on forums. This is not a valid argument in the real world environment.

The existing law allows the legal authority to give EADs to anyone. But current law is specific about the EB system works. Current law doesn't allow recapture of unused visas and exempting dependents from numerical limit. It is ironic but that is the law which was created long before President Obama took over the office. So it is not the fault of the President that this is how the current law is.

But if you look at what we are suggesting, it could help alleviate number of quality of life problems for skilled immigrants.

sachuin23
08-18-2014, 04:36 PM
What would Obama do for illegals? If we see that he authorizes legal permit for illegals then we would ask on why he can't authorize recapture of visas.

When we say "we" who exactly we mean? There have been lots of efforts in the past at local and national level and most of "we" did not show up. We just try to solve all these problems on forums, discussion board, predictions and blaming each other. When ever there is an opportunity where "we" can make a change we decide to do nothing and hope some one else would do the necessary for us. President administers by constitution and Aman explained it very well in his post what can and can not be done. IV has been working really hard for making life of legal immigrants easy. The points presented by Aman in his post would definitely make life easier for a lot of legal immigrants in this country. I would like to extend thanks to IV for the effort and would urge others to strengthen "WE" in I"V". Together we can do wonders and all we need to do is to focus on things that impact us as a community and work with IV to drive agenda of the community. Donations, meetings with local law makers, DC visits etc , are few things "we" can do to help us.

DallasBlue
08-18-2014, 09:13 PM
Perhaps you did not read through my message or maybe I was not clear enough. I would request you to read through the message and see the positive aspects of it because there are plenty of them if you see through it.

Lets be respectful for the needs and gravity of the issue. Its easy to ask this on forums. This is not a valid argument in the real world environment.

The existing law allows the legal authority to give EADs to anyone. But current law is specific about the EB system works. Current law doesn't allow recapture of unused visas and exempting dependents from numerical limit. It is ironic but that is the law which was created long before President Obama took over the office. So it is not the fault of the President that this is how the current law is.

But if you look at what we are suggesting, it could help alleviate number of quality of life problems for skilled immigrants.

did not AC21 capture unused visa numbers ? why cant obama do a clinton ?
has congressed passed a law and said no more visa captures ?

open.247
08-18-2014, 09:22 PM
did not AC21 capture unused visa numbers ? why cant obama do a clinton ?
has congressed passed a law and said no more visa captures ?

Why not just ask for citizenship for EB3 India people as admin fix. They have waited longest?

DallasBlue
08-18-2014, 09:28 PM
did not AC21 capture unused visa numbers ? why cant obama do a clinton ?
has congressed passed a law and said no more visa captures ?

unused visas:

http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/cisomb_2010_annual_report_to_congress.pdf
report page number :35
the pdf document page number: 53

Administrator2
08-18-2014, 09:28 PM
did not AC21 capture unused visa numbers ? why cant obama do a clinton ?
has congressed passed a law and said no more visa captures ?

Exactly - AC21. Please learn your history. AC21 was a law passed by Congress. AC21 is not something that President Clinton did by himself. Congress passed the bill and President (at the time) signed it.

So first of all there is a precedence that Congress had to pass a bill to recapture unused green cards.

Second, the existing law is clear that unused visas from previous years cannot be recaptured. Which means, yes, the current laws passed by Congress says no visa capture. The law specifically says how the visa are to be used every year and recapture requires act of Congress. And the proof is - AC21.

If you think this is wrong, why don't you go speak with the President and convince DHS to recapture. You seem to have all the right temperament, eloquent and arguments?

Anonymously arguing with me on forum is cheap. Doing something real is difficult. Just because I am spending my time answering questions doesn't mean you can go on and on. If you are so tough, why don't you come out in the open, put your name in public domain, spend your money, leave your job and go to Washington to convince WH, DHS, USCIS, House and Senate. Let me know when you decide to do it.

Administrator2
08-18-2014, 09:35 PM
unused visas:

http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/cisomb_2010_annual_report_to_congress.pdf
report page number :35
the pdf document page number: 53

This is 2010 USCIS Ombudsman report, which is 4 years old. So its not relevant.

And even according to this report you are quoting, there are zero (0) visas wasted for EB category since the year 2007. So your argument is not valid.

Did you not say that EB3-I visas are wasted. Where is the proof that EB3-I visas were wasted?

open.247
08-18-2014, 09:41 PM
This is 2010 USCIS Ombudsman report, which is 4 years old. So its not relevant.

And even according to this report you are quoting, there are zero (0) visas wasted for EB category since the year 2007. So your argument is not valid.

Did you not say that EB3-I visas are wasted. Where is the proof that EB3-I visas were wasted?

Why is old report not relevant?
It is the big idea that has value worth billions and millions of dollars. Nobody had this idea that DallasBlue came up with till now. You should give him credit for his idea.
Old is gold. Why don't you take this report in your next meeting and tell them what Dallas blue is saying. Who knows someone will like it and move EB3 India dates because of that.

We must try everything possible. Why not try this too. Does not seem to be a rocket science argument to convince to anyone as per me.

DallasBlue
08-18-2014, 10:09 PM
Exactly - AC21. Please learn your history. AC21 was a law passed by Congress. AC21 is not something that President Clinton did by himself. Congress passed the bill and President (at the time) signed it.

So first of all there is a precedence that Congress had to pass a bill to recapture unused green cards.

Second, the existing law is clear that unused visas from previous years cannot be recaptured. Which means, yes, the current laws passed by Congress says no visa capture. The law specifically says how the visa are to be used every year and recapture requires act of Congress. And the proof is - AC21.

If you think this is wrong, why don't you go speak with the President and convince DHS to recapture. You seem to have all the right temperament, eloquent and arguments?

Anonymously arguing with me on forum is cheap. Doing something real is difficult. Just because I am spending my time answering questions doesn't mean you can go on and on. If you are so tough, why don't you come out in the open, put your name in public domain, spend your money, leave your job and go to Washington to convince WH, DHS, USCIS, House and Senate. Let me know when you decide to do it.

my bad , thanks for education.

DallasBlue
08-18-2014, 10:55 PM
Exactly - AC21. Please learn your history. AC21 was a law passed by Congress. AC21 is not something that President Clinton did by himself. Congress passed the bill and President (at the time) signed it.

So first of all there is a precedence that Congress had to pass a bill to recapture unused green cards.

Second, the existing law is clear that unused visas from previous years cannot be recaptured. Which means, yes, the current laws passed by Congress says no visa capture. The law specifically says how the visa are to be used every year and recapture requires act of Congress. And the proof is - AC21.

If you think this is wrong, why don't you go speak with the President and convince DHS to recapture. You seem to have all the right temperament, eloquent and arguments?

Anonymously arguing with me on forum is cheap. Doing something real is difficult. Just because I am spending my time answering questions doesn't mean you can go on and on. If you are so tough, why don't you come out in the open, put your name in public domain, spend your money, leave your job and go to Washington to convince WH, DHS, USCIS, House and Senate. Let me know when you decide to do it.

Thanks a lot for your thankless service.

Ture you are on top of this issue.

fact is :
Unused Employment Preference Numbers from 1992 to 2009 : 506,410
( 180,039 were recaptured by special legislation)

clearly Legislative change is required as mentioned by you.

Administrator2
08-18-2014, 11:11 PM
What I am more interested in knowing is that why do big media outlets report everyhtjng to the contrary such as capturing unused EB numbers ~200k and excluding dependents from 140k EB based GC numerical limit ?

I am under the assumption is that there is a review of "interpretation of the law" between WH, USDOJ & DHS for both legal & illegal immigration. Big media outlets also have WH Pool reporters which feed news directly from sources inside WH.

Not saying IV is wrong or anything, but certainly there is something cooking in Washington in terms of improvements to legal EB based system.

Yes, there is something cooking. Some companies are engaged in drama to show their employees that they asked for more visas which administration did not give. So it is not the fault of employers but it is the fault of "Obama".

People need to be smart to distinguish between WWF and real Wrestling sport. News media is a tool to create specific impression and convince people to specific opinion. The politico story that came out today is referring too almost 3 week old meeting from 1st August.

And if it helps, you can keep believing what makes you happy. And when all this is over, if there is any consolation, you can come back to this thread to validate who was telling the truth.

DallasBlue
08-18-2014, 11:17 PM
This is 2010 USCIS Ombudsman report, which is 4 years old. So its not relevant.

And even according to this report you are quoting, there are zero (0) visas wasted for EB category since the year 2007. So your argument is not valid.

Did you not say that EB3-I visas are wasted. Where is the proof that EB3-I visas were wasted?

Thank you for the patient ear.

Let me try and explain:

In this document: http://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/publications/ois_lpr_fr_2013.pdf


Please take a look at , "table 2." on page 2. for 2013:

Skilled workers, professionals, unskilled workers ... 43,632


Please take a look at , "table A1." on page 6 annual limit for 2013

Third: Skilled workers, professionals, and needed unskilled workers ..................... 45,321†


The first number 43,632 is the total quota for EB3 , and the second number 45,321 is the visas issued for EB3 in that financial year.
The difference between these two numbers in the document is unused visas for EB3 category.
Thus 1689 visas were unused in EB3 Category for the FY2013. These visas were used for other categories while there is a decade of waiting time in EB3I.

similary EB3 quota was underutilized in past several financial years.

Hope this explanation helps.


The solution that we were proposing for not wasting EB3 visa numbers was to move the cut of date , a.k.a. the visa bulletin dates, to move much ahead for EB3 and EB3I so that the visa numbers are not wasted.

What we were asking from the begining of the financial year was that the dept. of state (DOS) and CO (Mr. Charles Oppenheim , Chief of the Visa Control and Reporting Division at the U.S. Department of State ) to move the cut off dates ahead so that full use of EB3 quota happens thus reducing the backlogs in EB3I thru spillovers.

Administrator2
08-18-2014, 11:19 PM
Thanks a lot for your thankless service.

Ture you are on top of this issue.

fact is :
Unused Employment Preference Numbers from 1992 to 2009 : 506,410
( 180,039 were recaptured by special legislation)

clearly Legislative change is required as mentioned by you.

Thanks DallasBlue

We would welcome others to get more actively involved in the good fight.

As you also probably often see that EB applicants question why are undocumented getting EADs, and why not us. EB applicants behave like spoil rich kid who feels entitled to benefit over others often without lifting a finger for the benefit.

Undocumented are standing up for themselves and their families. Their slogan is - Undocumented and Unafraid. Honestly, I salute their willingness to fight for their version of justice. Atleast they believe in something and are willing to stand-up for what they believe in.

Where is similar passion in EB community? Other than tracking LUDs, facebooking and hash-tagging, where are EB applicants seeking real change? Problems will continue to exist after all debates are over online forums. Please do not waste time online. Get into the real world of advocacy because that is the only way to make any policy change.

Administrator2
08-18-2014, 11:34 PM
Thank you for the patient ear.

Let me try and explain:

In this document: http://www.dhs.gov/sites/default/files/publications/ois_lpr_fr_2013.pdf


Please take a look at , "table 2." on page 2. for 2013:

Skilled workers, professionals, unskilled workers ... 43,632


Please take a look at , "table A1." on page 6 annual limit for 2013

Third: Skilled workers, professionals, and needed unskilled workers ..................... 45,321†


The first number 43,632 is the total quota for EB3 , and the second number 45,321 is the visas issued for EB3 in that financial year.
The difference between these two numbers in the document is unused visas for EB3 category.
Thus 1689 visas were unused in EB3 Category for the FY2013. These visas were used for other categories while there is a decade of waiting time in EB3I.

similary EB3 quota was underutilized in past several financial years.

Hope this explanation helps.


The solution that we were proposing for not wasting EB3 visa numbers was to move the cut of date , a.k.a. the visa bulletin dates, to move much ahead for EB3 and EB3I so that the visa numbers are not wasted.

What we were asking from the begining of the financial year was that the dept. of state (DOS) and CO (Mr. Charles Oppenheim , Chief of the Visa Control and Reporting Division at the U.S. Department of State ) to move the cut off dates ahead so that full use of EB3 quota happens thus reducing the backlogs in EB3I thru spillovers.

I have no way to validate your numbers. But if you truly believe in this, why don't you take this upon yourself and go to DC and setup appointments, and talk to some people. We have made these arguments years back and the data is no credible or inconclusive.

At IV, we do not have unlimited time and resources. We have only so much time and our focus is on policy issues. If you believe in seeking 100% efficiency of USCIS, rather than spending/wasting time talking about the same thing every day, why don't you go to Washington and talk to someone? Every time we post anything, which we think is 100 times more important, some folks keep repeating the same thing over and over again. What is the point of all this? I don't believe in this because your data is not convincing. So repeating the same thing over and over again will not change that. But you are free to do what you believe in. This thread has 100 times more relevant information about the subject at hand which we believe could potentially change hundreds and thousands of lives. What's the point of this back and forth on every thread all over the internet as if you have a smoking gun? And the more you keep repeating the same information, the more it sounds like a senseless broken record.

Please understand that repeating this information will not distract us from what we are working on. You are free to purse what you believe in, and we will work on what we believe in. Nothing wrong with that.

And this will be my last response on this subject. Hope I've clarified enough. Now you can go to Washington and do what you feel is best for you.

Administrator2
08-18-2014, 11:58 PM
Thanks for the update. It's not about what makes everyone or anyone happy. We don't need to be critical of answering any and every question. We're just here for an informed discussion on the topic and as you rightly said to separate facts from fiction.

I really don't need to validate anything anywhere. I know for a fact that IV and many companies are lobbying behind the scenes for greater good. Keep up the good work.

Different strokes for different people. End result will most likely be for the same cause. Just because one disapproves or disagrees with one thing doesn't make it wrong or right. There are gray areas everywhere.

There are grey ares everywhere. But certain things are crystal clear. Its is absolutely clear without a doubt that the Administration cannot give what they don't have. Some of these lawyers are smart people. They know what is possible. But when you don't want something to happen, then the way to make that happen is to ask for outrageous things that the other party cannot give. If you have a single shot at something, why would you shoot in the air rather than aiming for the target that you can see?

We don't believe companies are sincere in their (green card) ask because their cause is somewhat different. Companies are seeking EADs for anyone who do not qualify for H1 lottery. That is their real ask. So they are making such a big ask on green card that the Administration cannot give, and then they turn around to say that when you can give EADs for undocumented, why not give EADs to everyone who did not qualify for H1 lottery. This gives companies additional 200K/year H1s. This is a game which one will see through if you see this long enough.

So these are different causes. Companies want more workers with less rights. We want immigrants to have equal rights to peruse their happiness and live a life that each person is potentially capable of living. These two are conflicting ideas thus different causes.

Tarang
08-19-2014, 07:54 AM
I completely agree with "Companies want more workers with less rights". Isn't the same applicable to law firms many of which survive by filing H1/H4 extensions? Why would they want to let go hundreds of thousands of potential customers? And USCIS is also a self funded organization. I think they also would not want to lose revenues from H1/H4 extensions from a large population. So maintaining status quo is beneficial for many players on table and they will/can try their best to keep it that way while showing otherwise!!

immigrant2007
08-19-2014, 08:02 AM
some people never learn. That's the plight of so called successful VISa holders.

immigrant2007
08-19-2014, 08:04 AM
"EB VISA holders".
Can PM Modi help us? is it worth approaching him?

Administrator2
08-19-2014, 08:38 AM
I completely agree with "Companies want more workers with less rights". Isn't the same applicable to law firms many of which survive by filing H1/H4 extensions? Why would they want to let go hundreds of thousands of potential customers? And USCIS is also a self funded organization. I think they also would not want to lose revenues from H1/H4 extensions from a large population. So maintaining status quo is beneficial for many players on table and they will/can try their best to keep it that way while showing otherwise!!


Everything you said is probably correct. However, power lives with the people who are willing to stand-up for themselves. Its a longer journey, but it always works if people undergoing a circumstance are willing to change it.

Please do not wait for companies or lawyers or someone else to fix the system. Its not their fault if they are looking for their economic interest. Infact it should be expected and anyone expecting otherwise is foolish. Companies and lawyers are not evil, they are looking for their economic interest. But most EB immigrants are foolish, they DO NOT want to know what is cooking for them and how it will affect them even if they get green cards. The best EB applicants want to do is go to a lawyer website to cut-paste what she/he has to say and get back to LUD tracking, somehow expect someone else (companies or lawyer) to fix the system for them. This is insane. Companies and lawyers are not evil, its the fault of EB applicants who love telling stories about underdog changing the system, but are unwilling to follow that path with little bit of effort.

There is one and only one way to fix any system. It has to come from people affected by the circumstances. And when people feel that it's about time, that is the time for change. Until then, lets get back to LUD tracking discussion.

Administrator2
08-19-2014, 08:51 AM
"EB VISA holders".
Can PM Modi help us? is it worth approaching him?

There you go again. I've come to conclude that subconsciously EB applicants somehow feel that they are good for nothing. So people are always suggesting some idiot lawyer or a celebrity to carry the water. And when the list is exhausted, we turn to Modi. Give me a break.

Modi would want to help Indian companies to get more outsourcing. That requires more workers with less rights, not workers with equal rights. If everyone get green card, most people would want to not work for Indian outsourcing companies. Outsourcing requires revolving door where the workers at client site cannot leave. The best way to ensure this is to get trolleys grip on the neck of immigrant workers.

The only way to make any change is to stand up for yourself and not look for someone else to carry your water. That and only that can change the system, as soon as sufficient number of people are ready.

immigrant2007
08-19-2014, 09:56 AM
There you go again. I've come to conclude that subconsciously EB applicants somehow feel that they are good for nothing. So people are always suggesting some idiot lawyer or a celebrity to carry the water. And when the list is exhausted, we turn to Modi. Give me a break.

Modi would want to help Indian companies to get more outsourcing. That requires more workers with less rights, not workers with equal rights. If everyone get green card, most people would want to not work for Indian outsourcing companies. Outsourcing requires revolving door where the workers at client site cannot leave. The best way to ensure this is to get trolleys grip on the neck of immigrant workers.

The only way to make any change is to stand up for yourself and not look for someone else to carry your water. That and only that can change the system, as soon as sufficient number of people are ready.

There you go again

AceMan
08-19-2014, 12:24 PM
Thanks DallasBlue

We would welcome others to get more actively involved in the good fight.

As you also probably often see that EB applicants question why are undocumented getting EADs, and why not us. EB applicants behave like spoil rich kid who feels entitled to benefit over others often without lifting a finger for the benefit.

Undocumented are standing up for themselves and their families. Their slogan is - Undocumented and Unafraid. Honestly, I salute their willingness to fight for their version of justice. Atleast they believe in something and are willing to stand-up for what they believe in.

Where is similar passion in EB community? Other than tracking LUDs, facebooking and hash-tagging, where are EB applicants seeking real change? Problems will continue to exist after all debates are over online forums. Please do not waste time online. Get into the real world of advocacy because that is the only way to make any policy change.

I have a difference of opinion here.

Undocumented has got nothing to loose, everything is a bonus for them. So they can afford to fight unafraid. Just like Afridi batting.

Most members of EB community is here in the country obeying the immigration laws and more or less try to be on the right side of the law. We might circumvent the law, bend it and occasionally venture out of it, but unlike the undocumented we are not willful violators. In the heart most of the EB guys have republican values (again my humble opinion).

So I have a difference of opinion with IV in aligning our cause along with undocumented people. However I understand the compulsions of IV in going out as an united front for the cause.

As a visa holder, I respect this country and their laws. So if the law says something there is no point cribbing about it. The sincere efforts for HR 3012 is really a great insight to this great countries Democratic principles. Unlike India, where MP's and MLA's are whipped to vote for any bill and party's diktat, here we have members with voice, even if it is different. Chuck Grassley blocking the bill and Charles Schumer adding poison pill to HR 3012 was a great education.

IV's effort towards getting the administrative fixes for EB visas under the current framework of laws., show they are really sincere for the cause.

imh1b
08-19-2014, 12:53 PM
I have a difference of opinion here.

Undocumented has got nothing to loose, everything is a bonus for them. So they can afford to fight unafraid. Just like Afridi batting.

Most members of EB community is here in the country obeying the immigration laws and more or less try to be on the right side of the law. We might circumvent the law, bend it and occasionally venture out of it, but unlike the undocumented we are not willful violators. In the heart most of the EB guys have republican values (again my humble opinion).

So I have a difference of opinion with IV in aligning our cause along with undocumented people. However I understand the compulsions of IV in going out as an united front for the cause.

As a visa holder, I respect this country and their laws. So if the law says something there is no point cribbing about it. The sincere efforts for HR 3012 is really a great insight to this great countries Democratic principles. Unlike India, where MP's and MLA's are whipped to vote for any bill and party's diktat, here we have members with voice, even if it is different. Chuck Grassley blocking the bill and Charles Schumer adding poison pill to HR 3012 was a great education.

IV's effort towards getting the administrative fixes for EB visas under the current framework of laws., show they are really sincere for the cause.

Excuse me. So you are saying going to DC and meeting a senator is breaking the law? Contributing money to IV is breaking the law? Uploading a you tube video about us or interviewing on CNN about the backlog is breaking the law and we will lose our green card? Doing the rally is breaking a law and our green card will be cancelled?

Undocumented are doing all this.

I do not know what you understand by standing up for oneself that H1B immigrants are so scared of doing? I think they are just rich spoilt kids.

AceMan
08-19-2014, 01:20 PM
Excuse me. So you are saying going to DC and meeting a senator is breaking the law? Contributing money to IV is breaking the law? Uploading a you tube video about us or interviewing on CNN about the backlog is breaking the law and we will lose our green card? Doing the rally is breaking a law and our green card will be cancelled?

Undocumented are doing all this.

I do not know what you understand by standing up for oneself that H1B immigrants are so scared of doing? I think they are just rich spoilt kids.

Meeting Senator, contributing money, video's are not breaking law. Those are all sincere efforts.

Undocumented people are not my role models. I see them as willful violators, don't wish to stand up with them. Yes, I fear painted under the same color if I am associated with them. That's my choice and you can have a difference of opinion on that.

US law gives me the protection of what I can do legally as a work visa holder. However you have to be aware that seemingly trivial issues from other countries (DUI, shop lifting) have a serious ramifications for your green card process. So if you are in a rally and there are some unruly elements in there, I am no way going to jeopardize my GC process with that.

I am provided with whatever I 'need' in this country. Backlog elimination is what I 'want'.
I am not going to stand up for myself with 'on your face' attitude to the citizens of the country which I aspire to be one in future for a change in the law.

open.247
08-19-2014, 01:40 PM
Meeting Senator, contributing money, video's are not breaking law. Those are all sincere efforts.

Undocumented people are not my role models. I see them as willful violators, don't wish to stand up with them. Yes, I fear painted under the same color if I am associated with them. That's my choice and you can have a difference of opinion on that.

US law gives me the protection of what I can do legally as a work visa holder. However you have to be aware that seemingly trivial issues from other countries (DUI, shop lifting) have a serious ramifications for your green card process. So if you are in a rally and there are some unruly elements in there, I am no way going to jeopardize my GC process with that.

I am provided with whatever I 'need' in this country. Backlog elimination is what I 'want'.
I am not going to stand up for myself with 'on your face' attitude to the citizens of the country which I aspire to be one in future for a change in the law.

Almost everyone is illegal. Even legal ones. It is a big cover up.
Look at everyone application. Do you think no US citizen is in truth available? How many of you went out of status at one time or other? who came to study told a lie to immigration officer. Who paid to get green card. Who paid for H1B? Who paid to port? Was your labor process all handled by employer truthfully. You must have done something illegal so you are scared.

AceMan
08-19-2014, 01:57 PM
Almost everyone is illegal. Even legal ones. It is a big cover up.
Look at everyone application. Do you think no US citizen is in truth available? How many of you went out of status at one time or other? who came to study told a lie to immigration officer. Who paid to get green card. Who paid for H1B? Who paid to port? Was your labor process all handled by employer truthfully. You must have done something illegal so you are scared.

It is not what you or me think. Is it to the letter of the law? You might have done everything what you mentioned. You look silly if you try and paint everyone with the same color.

open.247
08-19-2014, 02:55 PM
It is not what you or me think. Is it to the letter of the law? You might have done everything what you mentioned. You look silly if you try and paint everyone with the same color.

So when I revealed your truth it hurt you and you started attacking? You know this is the reason why you got mad and started attacking. What illegal thing you did? It is time that the so called legals become naked.

AceMan
08-19-2014, 03:35 PM
So when I revealed your truth it hurt you and you started attacking? You know this is the reason why you got mad and started attacking. What illegal thing you did? It is time that the so called legals become naked.

Know the difference between a debate and an attack. You come up with baseless allegation from your experience. You don't even know what you are talking. You just smear dirt around and hold on to it.

Your line of discussion does not make any sense, nor add any value.

sachuin23
08-21-2014, 02:54 PM
So I'd like to discuss again why we @ IV think to the contrary when somebody senior who drafted the law thinks differently. Is it all smoke and mirrors or is there any reality to the situation ?

Obama's options for tech immigration take shape - Computerworld (http://m.computerworld.com/s/article/9250537/Obama_s_options_for_tech_immigration_take_shape?mm _ref=http%3A%2F%2Fwww..com%2Fusa-discussion-forums%2Fi140%2F1439865841%2Fwill-cir-pass-by-end-of-this-year%2Fpage%2Flast_page)

Former U.S. Rep. Bruce Morrison (D-Conn.), who chaired the House Immigration subcommittee responsible for drafting the 1990 immigration reform legislation that created the present system, believes the White House has the ability, via executive action, to allocate all available employment-based green cards to principals only.

Bruce Morrison is now a lobbyist and his job is to shoot for the starts for his clients. If this would have been a possibility, I am sure IV would have tried this option long back. We Administrator explained in his earlier posts immigration game is much more convoluted than what we think. IV Leadership has been working on this for years and they have first hand experience by now of what would work and what would not. However, lets wait and see. Based on media reports etc, we would know the myth vs reality in next few weeks and if this happens, I am sure, IV leadership and members would be among the first to applaud the President and administration.

eastindia
08-21-2014, 04:53 PM
Well lobbying or not doesn't matter in grand scheme of things. But somebody who drafted the law is assumed to know a bit and saying things on record is a big thing.

We sure will know in few days how things will pan out. I am an optimist. Hopefully all the news about legal immigration that has been doing rounds all over seems to have some element of truth to it. I am sure that IV is one of the groups that met with WH officials during summer.

So I have no doubt and I am not questioning at all IV's abilities or interests. It's more of a discussion point. Keep up the good work IV.

You are posting because you have never been ever to DC and participated in advocacy days. You would not have such doubts seeing IV clout.
The irony is that f the same administrator's message was posted by a lawyer on his website all of you would have been jumping around and copying and posting the message everywhere on forums. Not trusting your own capabilities is also our own weakness. Do you know IV volunteers analyze and draft laws that they present to lawmakers as a presentation for law changes? How would you know if you have never volunteered.

eastindia
08-21-2014, 07:31 PM
First of all stop this madness about advocacy days with every reply. It's getting ad nauseam.

People who have just been to advocacy days don't need to remind everyone about it. Doesn't make anyone special in context of the discussion.

Secondly I find it extremely disappointing when many replies are posted with capabilities and other non relevant stuff. Stay on the topic please.

Third is that I am well aware of work being done by IV and other lobbyists. I might not know everything, but just what I need to know. Just because somebody sat in a presentation DC doesn't make them an expert in context of immigration laws and their interpretation.

Last but not the least is somebody authentic and knows about laws talks on record like Bruce Morrison, there has to be some substance.
Your post smack of bloated ego and thinking that you know best and everyone else is lower. It is infact a big problem with the entire EB population and this is why they can never be united.

Firstly people who attended advocacy days are indeed special. They know more and it is important to talk again and again about its importance.

Secondly it is on topic. Precisely.

Thirdly I do not really think you know the work done by IV yet. This is why I said going to meetings is important to learn how things work. It is not sitting in a presentation but actually negotiating. Guess you have not been to such meetings so cannot imagine. People are more interested in reading visa forecasts and think that those guys are more intelligent and their heroes. Once you go to meetings you will know that those so called heroes are fools and ignorant. Real heroes are IV people who understand laws, write it all, present it, negotiate it. And these lobbyists you treat like gods are paid workers. You pay them and they will talk for you on your agenda. Many ex congressmen are lobbyists on kstreet. Guess you have not met any yet because you have never been to advocacy days!!

shining
08-21-2014, 08:56 PM
I guess its just a matter of time/days where we can know how the law actually got interpreted, the best thing with the law is it can get interpreted in different ways depending on how good the fine print is , given the sensitivity around this one --i am sure there would be lots of twists and turns --

Labor Day is not far --so I guess no one needs to defensive about anything.


Good luck EB3 and EB2 folks-- if the law does get interpreted your way and Obama signs an executive order --then it will be a great moment ---

Cheers
Shining

legalimmi11
08-21-2014, 08:57 PM
While I respect IV core and the work they have done but I agree with Atit here. They should be able to explain their reasoning to not support possible EO on dependent count at-least. Even if something has remote chances why they are ruling out. Which section of law says that numerical limits also apply to dependents. As per lot of reports ,USICS has applied these dependents count in their interpretation of law.

I don't want to have argument here but just a clear message. If yo think that I am ignorant, please educate me in inspiring way.

eastindia
08-21-2014, 11:03 PM
Nobody talks of ego. I guess if people with such attitude go to advocacy days, it sums it up perfectly for rest of us. I really don't want to be in such self appreciating company.

Only time will tell about success and failures. In the meanwhile enjoy your good for nothing self proclaimed advocacy.

Good for nothing self proclaimed advocacy is what you are describing this organization.
So what exactly are you doing here Mr Freeloader? Why don't you go back and join the prediction game. Hope that prediction will get your admin fix done sooner than IV.

eastindia
08-21-2014, 11:21 PM
Okay so can you please tout any recent success here with your so called advocacy ? I strongly suggest to add something meaningful and concrete other than misguided visions of grandeur about advocacy.

And "freeloader" is a considered personal attack ! Suggest you refrain from using words out of context and spirit of rules in this forum.

The upcoming executive order is a result of my meetings along with meetings of 50 other pele who came to DC spending their own money. You and others are going to reap the benefits for free. This is why the freeloader remark which again punctured the bloated ego. So here it is recent success. Other success is H4 rule this us coming is the result of IV hardwork. If you participate in IV conference calls for volunteers and meetings in advocacy days yu will know what is going on. But you are so busy with predictions and tracking. What will you know about advocacy.

Administrator2
08-22-2014, 12:03 AM
Guys, please stop this.

Eastindia, you are not the spokesperson of IV and you are not the only one who went to DC for advocacy days. Please stop this nonsense. What are you trying to achieve? These are genuine questions. If you don't know the answers then there is no need to pick a fight.

What's the point of talking if you don't have something important to say?

Administrator2
08-22-2014, 12:04 AM
Unfortunately the only answer you'll get here is you don't do advocacy. Apparently you can't be smart about US immigration laws since you didn't do any advocacy.

It's more about advocacy these days than have an intelligent and meaningful discussion.

Ok, you are very smart. Now work on EO.

Administrator2
08-22-2014, 12:32 AM
While I respect IV core and the work they have done but I agree with Atit here. They should be able to explain their reasoning to not support possible EO on dependent count at-least. Even if something has remote chances why they are ruling out. Which section of law says that numerical limits also apply to dependents. As per lot of reports ,USICS has applied these dependents count in their interpretation of law.

I don't want to have argument here but just a clear message. If yo think that I am ignorant, please educate me in inspiring way.

First of all no one is seeking respect from anyone. We would rather be much satisfied if folks decide to stand up for themselves and do something in the real world rather than hang around forums and predictions wasting precious time. Its wrong to waste your time like this on forums, arguing all day on meaningless discussions and predictions then expect something good come out of any bill and/or EO.

Please read carefully. We have repeated this plenty of times. We are saying that there are serious legal hurdles for any EO to do recapture of unused visas or exemption of dependents from numerical limits.

Again, we are not saying that IV is against recapture or exemption of dependents in EO. We are saying it won't happen based on the legal hurdles. If by some miracle, recapture or exemption are part of EO, we will very happily take it. IV also has recapture and exemption in our ask list for EO knowing well ahead of time that it won't happen.

It would be most convenient for us to cheerlead recapture and exemption EO and later claim that we were associated with it. But it will also be intellectually dishonest if we do not share with everyone that this is not happening. To the extent possible, we have always shared what is possible and likely to happen. Take or leave it. All these articles about exemption and recapture is a staged drama. You are free to watch this drama and think of this as live news, just like some people like to watch WWF. It is entirely your choice and free will.

The benefit of IV is that we tell you the truth. You can read lawyer's analysis, news articles and whatever comes your way and then continue to live in fools paradise in the world of date predictions. Or, you can plan for the future based on what is likely to happen. Again your choice.

Also, when you ask for something that the other person cannot give/don't have, then you miss that one chance to ask something that is/was possible. So our fixes are achievable and meaningful instead of asking for something that cannot be done by Administrative Action.

We are being forthcoming in telling everyone that the articles are bogus. Lawyer's analysis about President coming back from vacation to do EO means nothing because that is just not true. Lawyers are in the business of getting popular to do more business and media outlets have their agenda. Please be smart about consuming information and don't take everything thrown at you at its face value.

In the past, when we were unable to share information because of obvious constraints, then folks say IV is not sharing information. Now we are sharing information about what is actually going-on behind the scene and some people are concluding that IV not supporting EO for recapture or exemption.

Guys, please maintain some sanity and please take a moment to read what is being said and shared before jumping all over and picking useless fights with each other and wasting your time and energy. Please spend your time judiciously in making phone calls to your members of Congress and Senators from your State. Each member of Congress also has some role to play in EO. If nothing else, please do your share rather than attacking each other for no apparent reason.

shining
08-22-2014, 02:11 AM
Please spend your time judiciously in making phone calls to your members of Congress and Senators from your State. Each member of Congress also has some role to play in EO. If nothing else, please do your share rather than attacking each other for no apparent reason.


It will be very helpful if some script/talking points can be provided for talking with the senators/congressmen--will love to help wherever possible--

thanks
Shining

columbusdude007
08-23-2014, 04:41 PM
Again, we are not saying that IV is against recapture or exemption of dependents in EO. We are saying it won't happen based on the legal hurdles. If by some miracle, recapture or exemption are part of EO, we will very happily take it. IV also has recapture and exemption in our ask list for EO knowing well ahead of time that it won't happen.


Are you serious? Read this..

Obama has big options for green card, H-1B reform without Congress - Computerworld (http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9249614/Obama_has_big_options_for_green_card_H_1B_reform_w ithout_Congress_?taxonomyId=72&pageNumber=1)

The only thing that stands out on this site is the relentless solicitation for Donations! Other than that it is just a talking shop that has served no (that I am aware of) purpose till now!

Administrator2
08-23-2014, 05:04 PM
Are you serious? Read this..

Obama has big options for green card, H-1B reform without Congress - Computerworld (http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9249614/Obama_has_big_options_for_green_card_H_1B_reform_w ithout_Congress_?taxonomyId=72&pageNumber=1)

The only thing that stands out on this site is the relentless solicitation for Donations! Other than that it is just a talking shop that has served no (that I am aware of) purpose till now!

Thank you, appreciate your comments. So you think that Computer World article is telling you the truth? Sounds good then. If you don't think IV is doing anything then why do you show up here or post comments. You can just skip visiting us. All the best

shining
08-23-2014, 05:11 PM
. . . now be revised to filtering facts from friction

Cheers!!
Shining

columbusdude007
08-23-2014, 05:18 PM
It is obvious you don't really 'appreciate' my comments. It is not what I think or what Computerworld thinks that matters..it is what, those who matter, think that really matters like for example this:

The decision to count dependents against the caps "is an administrative interpretation" of the law, "and anything that's an administrative interpretation can be changed," said former U.S. Rep. Bruce Morrison (D-Conn.), who chaired the House Immigration subcommittee responsible for drafting the 1990 immigration reform legislation that created the present system.

columbusdude007
08-23-2014, 05:42 PM
. . . Now be revised to filtering facts from friction
cheers!!
Shining

roflmfao!

Administrator2
08-23-2014, 05:43 PM
It is obvious you don't really 'appreciate' my comments. It is not what I think or what Computerworld thinks that matters..it is what, those who matter, think that really matters like for example this:

The decision to count dependents against the caps "is an administrative interpretation" of the law, "and anything that's an administrative interpretation can be changed," said former U.S. Rep. Bruce Morrison (D-Conn.), who chaired the House Immigration subcommittee responsible for drafting the 1990 immigration reform legislation that created the present system.


I don't have time to respond to every idiot like you who lives in his shell and is afraid to come out in open. You hide behind his anonymity to attack others.

So you are saying it doesn't matter what you or computerworld thinks but it matters what some guy quoted in the article thinks? Who knows, maybe the person is a lobbyist and maybe he has his agenda to keep everyone thinking that something might happen, maybe folks can profit from people thinking that recapture and exemption can happen, who knows? We don't know the intentions of every person quoted in every article. It is not our job to micro analyze everyone in every article. Get that? How do you want us to comment on the intention of someone else quoted in some article? We don't care for folks who are not relevant. Is this person quoted in the article deciding the policy now? NO. Is she/he the decider? NO. Then why the hell does it matter what she/he thinks and for you to pick a fight with us. If you don't like what we are saying, just pass along. Its not very far, EO will be out close to labor day. You can see at the time who was telling the truth and who all quoted in all the different articles was exaggerating, won't we? So what's the point you are trying to make quoting some irrelevant article?

This will be the last you will hear from us on this argument. We are working on other provisions that we believe will help many million people, immigrants and US citizens. We would rather be working on our agenda than to respond to your irrelevant quotes from some obscure article.

Administrator2
08-23-2014, 05:46 PM
. . . now be revised to filtering facts from friction

Cheers!!
Shining

If you haven't noticed the title of the thread is -

"Possible Administrative Fixes - Filtering facts from fiction"

Which is why we are sharing what is not possible, and sharing what is possible.

Just because recapture and exemption are unlikely to happen, it doesn't mean other Admin fixes are not possible.

Open your mind, there is a world beyond recapture and exemption. But you will only see it if you are willing to see beyond the obvious.

columbusdude007
08-23-2014, 06:00 PM
Its not very far, EO will be out close to labor day. You can see at the time who was telling the truth and who all quoted in all the different articles was exaggerating, won't we?

AMEN!

This will be the last you will hear from us on this argument. We are working on other provisions that we believe will help many million people, immigrants and US citizens. We would rather be working on our agenda than to respond to your irrelevant quotes from some obscure article.

Wish you all the best!

gs1968
08-23-2014, 06:19 PM
The following link is to a very well-known article

ILW.COM - immigration news:Why We Can’t Wait: How President Obama Can Erase Immigrant Visa Backlogs with the Stroke of A Pen (http://www.ilw.com/articles/2012,0201-endelman.shtm)

Please pay attention to Footnote 8 after scrolling to the bottom of the page

Rep.Morrison is on record saying that there is no basis in the IMMACT 90 to argue that dependents should be exempt.The conference committee fixed the total numbers including dependents.Nothing in the Act has been amended since for him to change his viewpoint

Most of the players then are still alive and could possibly testify to this point if a legal challenge was presented

columbusdude007
08-23-2014, 06:38 PM
Whatever IV Admins or anyone for that matter think or do, it does not influence anything. The only thing that drives Law making and EO is politics. It was politics that made the POTUS to introduce DACA (inspite of repeatedly declaring that it was beyond his powers). That move paid off handsomely and he won a 2nd term. Now just as he was fixing to expand DACA with an eye on the Mid-Terms to help fellow Democrats, the public opinion has reportedly turned against expanding DACA putting at risk 5 Senate Dem Candidates in Red states. They have reportedly requested the POTUS to hold off on any moves that may endanger their chances of winning the seats. So, the think tank in the White House thinks that the POTUS needs to hold off the DACA expansion till after the Elections. But since the POTUS has repeatedly promised to take EA on Immigration, he needs to do something. That something turns out to be EO on Legal Immigration. It kills many birds with a single stone. It basically implements some provisions in HR3012 that was passed by a Bipartisan House but got derailed by the Republicans in the Senate. These same provisions are also contained in the CIR that was passed by a Bipartisan Senate. So, the POTUS and Democrats can claim that the Republicans are obstructionists and Democrats are the ones who are doers!! Oh by the way, enforcement has already been heightened along the border with more of the fence jumpers being apprehended and the deportation proceedings compressed to a 4th of the time. All of these will be played out on TV ads in the next 2 months hoping that Dems can retain the Senate!!

Administrator2
08-23-2014, 07:15 PM
Whatever IV Admins or anyone for that matter think or do, it does not influence anything. The only thing that drives Law making and EO is politics. It was politics that made the POTUS to introduce DACA (inspite of repeatedly declaring that it was beyond his powers). That move paid off handsomely and he won a 2nd term. Now just as he was fixing to expand DACA with an eye on the Mid-Terms to help fellow Democrats, the public opinion has reportedly turned against expanding DACA putting at risk 5 Senate Dem Candidates in Red states. They have reportedly requested the POTUS to hold off on any moves that may endanger their chances of winning the seats. So, the think tank in the White House thinks that the POTUS needs to hold off the DACA expansion till after the Elections. But since the POTUS has repeatedly promised to take EA on Immigration, he needs to do something. That something turns out to be EO on Legal Immigration. It kills many birds with a single stone. It basically implements some provisions in HR3012 that was passed by a Bipartisan House but got derailed by the Republicans in the Senate. These same provisions are also contained in the CIR that was passed by a Bipartisan Senate. So, the POTUS and Democrats can claim that the Republicans are obstructionists and Democrats are the ones who are doers!! Oh by the way, enforcement has already been heightened along the border with more of the fence jumpers being apprehended and the deportation proceedings compressed to a 4th of the time. All of these will be played out on TV ads in the next 2 months hoping that Dems can retain the Senate!!


Obviously you are knowledgeable about what is going to happen. Thanks for sharing that perspective, we appreciate that

shining
08-23-2014, 09:41 PM
The following link is to a very well-known article

ILW.COM - immigration news:Why We Can’t Wait: How President Obama Can Erase Immigrant Visa Backlogs with the Stroke of A Pen (http://www.ilw.com/articles/2012,0201-endelman.shtm)

Please pay attention to Footnote 8 after scrolling to the bottom of the page

Rep.Morrison is on record saying that there is no basis in the IMMACT 90 to argue that dependents should be exempt.The conference committee fixed the total numbers including dependents.Nothing in the Act has been amended since for him to change his viewpoint

Most of the players then are still alive and could possibly testify to this point if a legal challenge was presented


Thanks for sharing the article --very insightful and covers the spectrum of both family and employment based.

columbusdude007
08-24-2014, 08:25 AM
The following link is to a very well-known article

ILW.COM - immigration news:Why We Can’t Wait: How President Obama Can Erase Immigrant Visa Backlogs with the Stroke of A Pen (http://www.ilw.com/articles/2012,0201-endelman.shtm)

Please pay attention to Footnote 8 after scrolling to the bottom of the page

Rep.Morrison is on record saying that there is no basis in the IMMACT 90 to argue that dependents should be exempt.The conference committee fixed the total numbers including dependents.Nothing in the Act has been amended since for him to change his viewpoint

Most of the players then are still alive and could possibly testify to this point if a legal challenge was presented

Those are all good talking points in a Court. But they have not been specified in the Act. That is the reason the very same Morrison is now singing a different tune!

Administrator2
08-24-2014, 01:45 PM
Those are all good talking points in a Court. But they have not been specified in the Act. That is the reason the very same Morrison is now singing a different tune!

You are something. You just like to argue and pick a fight with others , don't you?

Someone messaged saying that you were trashing us on other websites. We don't care what you do else where but what is the point of this argument? Did we not agree that we will all know when the EO will be announced?

There is so much legal precedence, law and events, foot notes, floor speeches from sponsors about the interpretation of the law when it was being created, and together it provides significant legal challenges for the Administration to do recapture or dependents exemption. This is what the decision makers have said. Any one can disagree with what they think but what matters is what the Administration thinks.

What is IV saying?
IV is telling the truth about what is going on behind the scene.

What is the understanding of some misguided people?
When IV is sharing what decision makers are telling about serious legal challenges for doing exemption or recapture, misguided people who have trouble understanding English, these people seem to understand as if IV is against exemption or recapture, which is totally false.

Recapture
There is a precedence for recapture by Congress under AC21 law. So Congress has retained the authority to recapture unused green cards and the AC21 change in law recaptured green cards one time and it did not say automatic recapture for any unused green cards going forward. 140K green number is a cap (or ceiling). Law DOES NOT say that USCIS must allocate annual quota of 140K visa. Rather the law says that 140K is a cap (meaning USCIS can allocate any number of visas less that 140K, which could be even zero green cards).

Exempting dependents
During the Senate IMMACT debates (in 1989) Senator Specter expressed the understanding that spouses will continue to be counted in his remarks in support of an amendment increasing the employment-based immigrant visa cap by 30,000 are below:

“Mr. President, the experience has demonstrated that there is a significant demand for more business visas. More than half of the current 54,000 business visas are used for family dependents. I do not quarrel with that allocation. But the result is that less than 25,000 visas actually go to the workers.”

Source: 135 Cong. Rec. S7858-02 (July 10, 1989)

Senator Specter then introduced into the record a letter from the Chamber of Commerce supporting the amendment to increase employment-based immigrant visa cap. Interestingly, the letter highlights the fact that dependents will continue to count against the employment-based cap as evidence of the diminished impact of the increase on the U.S. labor market:

“The Specter/DeConcini amendment will propose only a very modest increase (30,000 visas) in the employer-sponsored immigration categories. It may be expected that approximately half the increase will be used by family members of principal employee-immigrants. Thus, the amendment will permit only an additional 15,000-20,000 employer-sponsored immigrants. This small number, together with the fact that these immigrants cannot be sponsored unless the Department of Labor has certified that their skills are not available in the U.S., guarantees that there will be no significant adverse impact on the U.S. labor market. In fact, the labor market impact will be positive because these needed skills enhance productivity and create employment.”

Source: 135 Cong. Rec. S7858-02 (July 10, 1989).

This if from Congressional record which is set in stone and cannot be changed.

This is just one part. Over the years, there have been hundreds of such references and some of the bills considered in Congress have tried to pass dependents exemption from numerical count, meaning that the current law and the original intent of the Congress did not include exemption from dependents.

So it is not true that Congressional intent was not to count dependents in EB, or, if there is any ambiguity around counting dependents. Moreover, the law, section 1255(b) seals the fate of this suggestion without a doubt.

You can continue to be one of those guys who think immigration lawyers are Gods and whatever they say is the only truth. Your choice. Our observation is some lawyers say/make outrageous claims online, just so they are popular and quoted in different places, obviously being popular leads to more business for them. Which is why we started this thread to help people to filter out fact from fiction because there is so much misinformation out there. If you don't like what we are sharing, to get kick out of argument you can go to some lawyer website who agrees with you. There is absolutely no need for you to argue or hang around here.

You are Welcome!

columbusdude007
08-24-2014, 08:41 PM
You are something. You just like to argue and pick a fight with others , don't you?

Someone messaged saying that you were trashing us on other websites. We don't care what you do else where but what is the point of this argument? Did we not agree that we will all know when the EO will be announced?

There is so much legal precedence, law and events, foot notes, floor speeches from sponsors about the interpretation of the law when it was being created, and together it provides significant legal challenges for the Administration to do recapture or dependents exemption. This is what the decision makers have said. Any one can disagree with what they think but what matters is what the Administration thinks.

What is IV saying?
IV is telling the truth about what is going on behind the scene.

What is the understanding of some misguided people?
When IV is sharing what decision makers are telling about serious legal challenges for doing exemption or recapture, misguided people who have trouble understanding English, these people seem to understand as if IV is against exemption or recapture, which is totally false.

Recapture
There is a precedence for recapture by Congress under AC21 law. So Congress has retained the authority to recapture unused green cards and the AC21 change in law recaptured green cards one time and it did not say automatic recapture for any unused green cards going forward. 140K green number is a cap (or ceiling). Law DOES NOT say that USCIS must allocate annual quota of 140K visa. Rather the law says that 140K is a cap (meaning USCIS can allocate any number of visas less that 140K, which could be even zero green cards).

Exempting dependents
During the Senate IMMACT debates (in 1989) Senator Specter expressed the understanding that spouses will continue to be counted in his remarks in support of an amendment increasing the employment-based immigrant visa cap by 30,000 are below:



Source: 135 Cong. Rec. S7858-02 (July 10, 1989)

Senator Specter then introduced into the record a letter from the Chamber of Commerce supporting the amendment to increase employment-based immigrant visa cap. Interestingly, the letter highlights the fact that dependents will continue to count against the employment-based cap as evidence of the diminished impact of the increase on the U.S. labor market:



Source: 135 Cong. Rec. S7858-02 (July 10, 1989).

This if from Congressional record which is set in stone and cannot be changed.

This is just one part. Over the years, there have been hundreds of such references and some of the bills considered in Congress have tried to pass dependents exemption from numerical count, meaning that the current law and the original intent of the Congress did not include exemption from dependents.

So it is not true that Congressional intent was not to count dependents in EB, or, if there is any ambiguity around counting dependents. Moreover, the law, section 1255(b) seals the fate of this suggestion without a doubt.

You can continue to be one of those guys who think immigration lawyers are Gods and whatever they say is the only truth. Your choice. Our observation is some lawyers say/make outrageous claims online, just so they are popular and quoted in different places, obviously being popular leads to more business for them. Which is why we started this thread to help people to filter out fact from fiction because there is so much misinformation out there. If you don't like what we are sharing, to get kick out of argument you can go to some lawyer website who agrees with you. There is absolutely no need for you to argue or hang around here.

You are Welcome!
No one can resist an idea whose time has come!

Administrator2
08-24-2014, 08:59 PM
No one can resist an idea whose time has come!

You are amazing. So your response is quoting some adage to imply that Administration wants to do recapture and exemption of dependents, but somehow IV is resisting it. I think we've seen many different type of people on these forums but never came across an idiot such as you.

columbusdude007
08-24-2014, 09:25 PM
You are amazing. So your response is quoting some adage to imply that Administration wants to do recapture and exemption of dependents, but somehow IV is resisting it. I think we've seen many different type of people on these forums but never came across an idiot such as you.
No. Not both. Just the exemption of dependents. I doubt if IV can resist it for the simple reason "No one can resist an idea whose time has come!" We will know who is an idiot very soon dude. Just wait for a few days. Maybe you can use your seeming mastery of the Law to help out forum posters who have typical problems instead of running your mouth on this thread.

rupen
08-24-2014, 09:50 PM
No. Not both. Just the exemption of dependents. I doubt if IV can resist it for the simple reason "No one can resist an idea whose time has come!" We will know who is an idiot very soon dude. Just wait for a few days. Maybe you can use your seeming mastery of the Law to help out forum posters who have typical problems instead of running your mouth on this thread.

I read this thread just now and saw this discussion stretching too far. so, I thought I should reply.

You and IV both want recapture and dependent exemption. Only difference is that IV by talking to DHS and WH administration knows that it can not be done administratively but based on the research that you have done and the information that you have got from other sources think that it can be done. So, let's complete this discussion at this point and move on to do things which would add value. You might have many legal and valid points on why this should be possible but it is not IV that you have to convince. It is WH and DHS who are going to make decision that you have to convince.

penguin80
08-25-2014, 12:43 PM
In some of the posts a lot of legal argument has already been regarding how the counting is done towards the cap. Can we have some discussion regarding legal aspects of recaptuing of unused visas. Below is a link to some obscure article on this topic.
Unused Visas: To Recapture or Not to Recapture- That Is The Question | Watson Immigration Law Blog (http://watsonimmigration.wordpress.com/2014/08/22/unused-visa-to-recapture-or-not-to-recapture-that-is-the-question/)

Here is what the Immigration Nationality Act says at § 206 (8 USC 1156):
If an immigrant having an immigrant visa is denied admission to the United States and removed, or does not apply for admission before the expiration of the validity of his visa, or if an alien having an immigrant visa issued to him as a preference immigrant is found not to be a preference immigrant, an immigrant visa or a preference immigrant visa, as the case may be, may be issued in lieu thereof to another qualified alien.


This seems like a valid argument for recapturing unused visa. I understand IV has already worked towards getting H4 working status, but we really need a push to have people waiting in line for Eb2/Eb3 visas.

penguin80
08-25-2014, 01:03 PM
This is another article in favor of not counting relatives.
It basically says it doesn't matter what congressman discussed or stated during debates while passing a law, what matters is actual written word in the law. And if the law is ambiguous, executive branch can reinterpret the law.

The Insightful Immigration Blog – Commentaries on Immigration Policy, Cases and Trends: TWO ACES UP PRESIDENT OBAMA’S SLEEVE TO ACHIEVE IMMIGRATION REFORM WITHOUT CONGRESS – NOT COUNTING FAMILY MEMBERS AND PAROLE IN PLACE (http://blog.cyrusmehta.com/2014/06/two-aces-up-president-obamas-sleeve-to_29.html)

sunny2007
08-25-2014, 03:08 PM
IV : Should have a poll and see...I bet 99% of IV members want dependents to be removed from the count.

No point in shouting @ people who are requesting this.

Influence with 100k signatures/faxes before it's too late for EO.

I remember that when people were asking for H4 benefits , you guys were against it initially but later pursued it.

spicy_guy
08-25-2014, 04:33 PM
IV : Should have a poll and see...I bet 99% of IV members want dependents to be removed from the count.

No point in shouting @ people who are requesting this.

Influence with 100k signatures/faxes before it's too late for EO.

I remember that when people were asking for H4 benefits , you guys were against it initially but later pursued it.

Sunny,

IV was never against anything that helps the Immi community. You should just read between the lines!

Think this way: why would IV want go against such cases? Any stake? IV may have said that in some way may mean one of "not enough support", "not the right time", "busy with other things", etc.

sunny2007
08-25-2014, 04:52 PM
Sunny,

IV was never against anything that helps the Immi community. You should just read between the lines!

Think this way: why would IV want go against such cases? Any stake? IV may have said that in some way may mean one of "not enough support", "not the right time", "busy with other things", etc. Hmm..Twisting facts ? We have to read between the heads ?

spicy_guy
08-25-2014, 05:04 PM
Hmm..Twisting facts ? We have to read between the heads ?

If.... that is your take on it...

rupen
08-25-2014, 07:30 PM
Hmm..Twisting facts ? We have to read between the heads ?

I do not understand what the problem really is. If we do a poll here asking if people want dependent exemption change, I believe there would be 100% people supporting it not even 99%. But there is a difference between what we want and what we can get. IV's stand is that since it has talked to WH and DHS and know that this can not be done through EO, they are just informing us that it is the case. If just informing this makes IV against this measure then yes they can be considered as against it. However, if they were really against it, they would not have included it in the ASK list.

I know that are number of news reports and lawyers telling that it is possible. May be they have more information than what IV has or they still want to advertise it knowing that it can not be done. Whatever be the case, it is not important to what we are discussing. I know that the change that we so much want and when many others are saying that it can be done, when IV says it can not be done, we do not feel good about it. But please understand the difference between assessment and desire.

If you strongly feel that this can be done, there are many other online forums where people are saying that it can be done and taking actions what they believe is the right action.

Other than this item, there are other items that IV has outlined as part of EO. If you think that they are valuable, you can take actions here what IV suggests.

Administrator2
08-25-2014, 11:50 PM
This is another article in favor of not counting relatives.
It basically says it doesn't matter what congressman discussed or stated during debates while passing a law, what matters is actual written word in the law. And if the law is ambiguous, executive branch can reinterpret the law.

The Insightful Immigration Blog – Commentaries on Immigration Policy, Cases and Trends: TWO ACES UP PRESIDENT OBAMA’S SLEEVE TO ACHIEVE IMMIGRATION REFORM WITHOUT CONGRESS – NOT COUNTING FAMILY MEMBERS AND PAROLE IN PLACE (http://blog.cyrusmehta.com/2014/06/two-aces-up-president-obamas-sleeve-to_29.html)

Thanks for sharing these notes/articles. These arguments were presented already. But we appreciate sharing positive valuable information. Please continue to share any other supporting information because it always helps to provide as many angles and arguments as possible. We have not given up but need everyone to understand the reality. We need credible and reasonable arguments. Just saying "take a poll and 99% IV members will say this" or "idea cannot stop whose time has come" sounds too emotional, phony and immature. We cannot go and say this to the folks who genuinely wants to help.

We welcome more positive arguments and ideas in favor of exemption and recapture. And have been asking for this for sometime. But again, please try to be mature about arguments in favor. IV members are not members of Congress, so such a poll adds no value to a legal question.

And BTW, it does matter what sponsoring Senator said. The context and intent of the law has high significance even in the court of law. Because they anticipate backlash and attacks from the other side, the Administration has already said that they will only do things that are within the existing law.

krupa
08-26-2014, 10:06 AM
You are amazing. So your response is quoting some adage to imply that Administration wants to do recapture and exemption of dependents, but somehow IV is resisting it. I think we've seen many different type of people on these forums but never came across an idiot such as you.

Dear Administrator 2

This is not a fair language by you.

gdgtgeek
08-26-2014, 12:31 PM
I have read through all the comments.
Here is my understanding - IV is not saying they do not support such a change. All they are saying is that we believe it is not possible within the context of the law. Even if the President were to do such a thing, as the cited blogs and articles mention, in IV's opinion, there is a high likelihood that it may be challenged by Congress and possibly overturned.

Now imagine, yourself going to the person X (someone in power) and telling him to do something, because you believe it is possible, he says Ok, turns to his internal legal team which determines that what you told him is wrong. At that point, does the person X trust you? Trust you enough that next time you come and ask him for something else, he will honor your request, or even bother listening to you?

I do believe that skilled immigrants should have a united front. If you do not believe that IV, as an organization is supporting the causes you believe in, then you are free to go support someone else who does, but for the sake of keeping a united front, please do not bad mouth someone just because they do not have the same point of view as you on a minor issue in a bigger battle. Just my 2 cents.

Also, informed discussion between ourselves is great. But guess what, it does not do Shit to convince Congresspeople and Senators to support our cause. Neither do new articles. Only thing that works in meeting them face to face, day in and day out so that they know this is a real problem.

Here is what corporations are spending on lobbying. Why? Because, they know its effective!
https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/top.php?indexType=s

Going to DC, organizing events, takes money. If you cannot volunteer your time, or your money for this effort, the least you can do is not bad mouth the organization, that is doing something.

Inviting more personal attacks.....

spicy_guy
08-26-2014, 12:40 PM
I have read through all the comments.
Here is my understanding - IV is not saying they do not support such a change. All they are saying is that we believe it is not possible within the context of the law. Even if the President were to do such a thing, as the cited blogs and articles mention, in IV's opinion, there is a high likelihood that it may be challenged by Congress and possibly overturned.

Now imagine, yourself going to the person X (someone in power) and telling him to do something, because you believe it is possible, he says Ok, turns to his internal legal team which determines that what you told him is wrong. At that point, does the person X trust you? Trust you enough that next time you come and ask him for something else, he will honor your request, or even bother listening to you?

I do believe that skilled immigrants should have a united front. If you do not believe that IV, as an organization is supporting the causes you believe in, then you are free to go support someone else who does, but for the sake of keeping a united front, please do not bad mouth someone just because they do not have the same point of view as you on a minor issue in a bigger battle. Just my 2 cents.

Also, informed discussion between ourselves is great. But guess what, it does not do Shit to convince Congresspeople and Senators to support our cause. Neither do new articles. Only thing that works in meeting them face to face, day in and day out so that they know this is a real problem.

Here is what corporations are spending on lobbying. Why? Because, they know its effective!
https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/top.php?indexType=s

Going to DC, organizing events, takes money. If you cannot volunteer your time, or your money for this effort, the least you can do is not bad mouth the organization, that is doing something.

Inviting more personal attacks.....

+10. Well put out!

mrjonie
08-26-2014, 12:54 PM
I have read through all the comments.
Here is my understanding - IV is not saying they do not support such a change. All they are saying is that we believe it is not possible within the context of the law. Even if the President were to do such a thing, as the cited blogs and articles mention, in IV's opinion, there is a high likelihood that it may be challenged by Congress and possibly overturned.

Now imagine, yourself going to the person X (someone in power) and telling him to do something, because you believe it is possible, he says Ok, turns to his internal legal team which determines that what you told him is wrong. At that point, does the person X trust you? Trust you enough that next time you come and ask him for something else, he will honor your request, or even bother listening to you?

I do believe that skilled immigrants should have a united front. If you do not believe that IV, as an organization is supporting the causes you believe in, then you are free to go support someone else who does, but for the sake of keeping a united front, please do not bad mouth someone just because they do not have the same point of view as you on a minor issue in a bigger battle. Just my 2 cents.

Also, informed discussion between ourselves is great. But guess what, it does not do Shit to convince Congresspeople and Senators to support our cause. Neither do new articles. Only thing that works in meeting them face to face, day in and day out so that they know this is a real problem.

Here is what corporations are spending on lobbying. Why? Because, they know its effective!
https://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/top.php?indexType=s

Going to DC, organizing events, takes money. If you cannot volunteer your time, or your money for this effort, the least you can do is not bad mouth the organization, that is doing something.

Inviting more personal attacks.....


I am surprised to see the number of personal attacks and derogatory accusations among the members. Heard a lot about another website dealing with immigration and happen to visit recently. They have more meaningful discussions referring to more up to date news.. and we here are cursing each other. Quite soon ppl will drop out of this site and organization.. Admins and leaders, please take a note of this.

spicy_guy
08-26-2014, 01:23 PM
I am surprised to see the number of personal attacks and derogatory accusations among the members. Heard a lot about another website dealing with immigration and happen to visit recently. They have more meaningful discussions referring to more up to date news.. and we here are cursing each other. Quite soon ppl will drop out of this site and organization.. Admins and leaders, please take a note of this.

I do not see anything person in the above write up. Its just informational. Please do not raise a flag it as personal.

Better yet, just leave this discussion here and focus on other meaningful things.
How about donating and helping IV?

shining
08-26-2014, 01:35 PM
In the current scenario, there are several possibilities. I don't think an EO will be a straight forward option and in politics anything can change at the last moment.

The conservative democrats are not going to be sanguine about the the executive order, especially Mark Pryor from Arkansas and Kay Hagan from North Carolina. EO in the short term can rattle them and possibly these folks don't make it.

The other way to look at even though some of these democrats from the conservative states like Arkansas, Alaska, North Carolina and Louisiana may have an angst and lose, it may be all good from 2016 presidential elections as Democrats will have a lot of say where they can say --they actually did make a change and supported immigration and get lot of latino support.

Another thing who knows may be that there is already some last minute negotiations going on where republicans from the house agree to get the bill considered after they come back from the recess and this will all put an end to an EO and a win-win from politics stand point--

Right now we are in a state of oblivion with whether EO will really take place and if it does what it will have and what it won't. I am sure IV involved in the background has more information than any of us and there certainly are hurdles.

The question is what next ---I expect IV to at least put some action items/next steps where we can reinvirogate forum readers/donors/volunteers to work on something. I know in the past on this forum we have heard --the Signature thing does not work and it will be a waste of time. The question is that there does not seem to be any concrete next steps and hence the oblivion and theories continue.

So would request IV to maybe close this thread and start a new thread with a set of action items and that will be cordially supported.

Cheers
Shining

mrjonie
08-26-2014, 03:02 PM
I do not see anything person in the above write up. Its just informational. Please do not raise a flag it as personal.

Better yet, just leave this discussion here and focus on other meaningful things.
How about donating and helping IV?

I did not say the above write-up, Obviously you haven't seen the rest of posts and drama.Well, as you said I am leaving it here and continue with the other suggestions you recommended. Cheers !

pd052011
08-26-2014, 04:16 PM
In the current scenario, there are several possibilities. I don't think an EO will be a straight forward option and in politics anything can change at the last moment.

The conservative democrats are not going to be sanguine about the the executive order, especially Mark Pryor from Arkansas and Kay Hagan from North Carolina. EO in the short term can rattle them and possibly these folks don't make it.

The other way to look at even though some of these democrats from the conservative states like Arkansas, Alaska, North Carolina and Louisiana may have an angst and lose, it may be all good from 2016 presidential elections as Democrats will have a lot of say where they can say --they actually did make a change and supported immigration and get lot of latino support.

Another thing who knows may be that there is already some last minute negotiations going on where republicans from the house agree to get the bill considered after they come back from the recess and this will all put an end to an EO and a win-win from politics stand point--

Right now we are in a state of oblivion with whether EO will really take place and if it does what it will have and what it won't. I am sure IV involved in the background has more information than any of us and there certainly are hurdles.

The question is what next ---I expect IV to at least put some action items/next steps where we can reinvirogate forum readers/donors/volunteers to work on something. I know in the past on this forum we have heard --the Signature thing does not work and it will be a waste of time. The question is that there does not seem to be any concrete next steps and hence the oblivion and theories continue.

So would request IV to maybe close this thread and start a new thread with a set of action items and that will be cordially supported.

Cheers
Shining

I second that. I trust IV with communicating our issues up the political command in Congress and WH.

GCkiyaGanja
08-26-2014, 06:29 PM
I am no pundit on these matters , but I have just let IV represent me . (do I have any other voice ?).

Will do my phone calls , rallies what ever is in my capacity & leave the rest to IV & hope. BTW advocacy walon sorry I have never been to advocacy events , so please dont bash me up here.

Every September onwards there is some news that this will happen that will happen (HR3012 remember that ? I still have the t-shirt from the SanJose rally :) . My friends whom I literally begged to fly in from Dallas and drive from LA still curse me for forcing them to come to the rally ) ...hota kuch nahi hai....not IV's fault at all , it is just politics. So what is the point in bashing each other up here.

I remember watching IV representatives presenting the case on c-span, i think it was some committee , they hardly gave us time to speak..now if that is how we are being heard or not heard then how can we fault IV.

IV says call senators call them,,paisa nahi lagta..if it works good for all of us , else status quo.. everyone know its politics, money , lobbying etc don't let emotions get over and fight it out here.. kuch nahi honay wala , average wait time for GC is 10 years..na jayada na kum bubble gum :).

Chalo shuru ho jao galiyan baknay.. :)

shining
08-26-2014, 07:03 PM
I am no pundit on these matters , but I have just let IV represent me . (do I have any other voice ?).

Chalo shuru ho jao galiyan baknay.. :)


All I can say --you have a very creative name --LOL

greyhair
08-26-2014, 09:31 PM
This is what House is good for

CNmwnu4QzLg

columbusdude007
08-26-2014, 11:02 PM
Dear Administrator 2

This is not a fair language by you.
Admins gone wild? ROFLFMAO.

abcdgc
08-27-2014, 12:41 AM
Admins gone wild? ROFLFMAO.

It bothers me that one person can make the entire topic stink. I used to like visiting internet forums. Lately not because of you, but because of people who watch your shit silently, I try not to visit any immigration forums. Every now and then when I stumble into forums it bothers me that most people who visit here stay silent even when dumb shits like you attack well intended people and spending their time to fix my problems.

It doesn't bother me what you post because you are born fuckhead and that is how you are suppose to behave. What bothers me is others who silently watch people like you fuck around all over the place without at least being questioned of your intent.

Have you done anything for my problems of having to wait in backlog? If the answer is no and then if you attack people working to fix my problems and problems of thousands others, how will it be fair for me to just glance through without saying anything and pass-by when you are pissing all over the place.

We all want green card. The first thing I learned about American society is that people speak up when they see fuckers like you. Don't see others here getting angry over what handful get away with. Which is why we are all waiting in backlogs because that is what we deserve.

Handful of people like here like drop of ink in a jug of water, making the entire environment non-consumable. But people who knowing remain silent are like poison in jug of water killing anyone who might drink it by mistake.

"Silence becomes cowardice when occasion demands speaking out the whole truth and acting accordingly."
~ Mahatma Gandhi

columbusdude007
08-27-2014, 08:26 AM
It bothers me that one person can make the entire topic stink. I used to like visiting internet forums. Lately not because of you, but because of people who watch your shit silently, I try not to visit any immigration forums. Every now and then when I stumble into forums it bothers me that most people who visit here stay silent even when dumb shits like you attack well intended people and spending their time to fix my problems.

It doesn't bother me what you post because you are born fuckhead and that is how you are suppose to behave. What bothers me is others who silently watch people like you fuck around all over the place without at least being questioned of your intent.

Have you done anything for my problems of having to wait in backlog? If the answer is no and then if you attack people working to fix my problems and problems of thousands others, how will it be fair for me to just glance through without saying anything and pass-by when you are pissing all over the place.

We all want green card. The first thing I learned about American society is that people speak up when they see fuckers like you. Don't see others here getting angry over what handful get away with. Which is why we are all waiting in backlogs because that is what we deserve.

Handful of people like here like drop of ink in a jug of water, making the entire environment non-consumable. But people who knowing remain silent are like poison in jug of water killing anyone who might drink it by mistake.

"Silence becomes cowardice when occasion demands speaking out the whole truth and acting accordingly."
~ Mahatma Gandhi
"Silence becomes cowardice when occasion demands speaking out the whole truth and acting accordingly."
~ Mahatma Gandhi

amulchandra
08-27-2014, 10:43 AM
I am just wondering if it is possible to exclude dependents as a one time measure for a year or two instead of doing it as an open ended EO. Can this be done within the existing limits of the law? Such as measure might at least reduce the backlogs if not eliminate them completely. May be that way the backlash might be reduced if the EO in our case is considered overreaching. Just a thought!

AceMan
08-27-2014, 11:42 AM
I appreciate the effort of IV for clearing the backlog. However I have serious difference of opinion with respect to aligning with non-documented group in pushing a resolution for the immigration issue.

With HR 3012 IV alienated ROW crowd.

Maybe we should give a thought to start working with Roy Beck, and try a different way. Their position has always been clear. Just a thought.

vikidisi
08-27-2014, 12:14 PM
I appreciate the effort of IV for clearing the backlog. However I have serious difference of opinion with respect to aligning with non-documented group in pushing a resolution for the immigration issue.

With HR 3012 IV alienated ROW crowd.

Maybe we should give a thought to start working with Roy Beck, and try a different way. Their position has always been clear. Just a thought.

AceMan - I thought this country has provided everything you need? Then why even bother with different ways and Rory Becks etc. when you are enjoying all the benefits of a H1-B visa?

AceMan
08-27-2014, 12:47 PM
AceMan - I thought this country has provided everything you need? Then why even bother with different ways and Rory Becks etc. when you are enjoying all the benefits of a H1-B visa?

When you see things as personal, your judgement gets clouded. Is that your best shot? It is not my need or my want. I respect the rules of the land. Anyways I will try and put forward my point.

On the other side you have conservative citizens group who are against immigration and they are a very powerful group. Their voices are heard across over by US Citizens. It is a different matter, lot of people don't agree with them. However decision makers don't object it. They are the voters who decide the fate of representatives now. Not 20 years down the line.

Legal immigration IV is representing is very minuscule in the big picture of immigration reform. However if IV were with the other group, the chances that legal immigrants plight, may be seen in a different light compared to the undocumented.

If you think it is not workable, counter it with your reasons, instead of harping over my benefits.

columbusdude007
08-27-2014, 01:06 PM
I am just wondering if it is possible to exclude dependents as a one time measure for a year or two instead of doing it as an open ended EO. Can this be done within the existing limits of the law? Such as measure might at least reduce the backlogs if not eliminate them completely. May be that way the backlash might be reduced if the EO in our case is considered overreaching. Just a thought!
That is a pipe dream. Once interpreted, it will remain that way, till a Law is passed explicitly dealing with that topic.

dkshitij
08-27-2014, 01:56 PM
I have done some foolish things and some good things when it comes to helping IV. Before I knew how the system worked, I signed online petitions, crunched numbers and date movements, discussed why IV does not do XYZ on the forums etc. But I have done few good things - donated miles for advocacy days, sent money when possible, met with Congressman & Senators. These things made the most impact. Could I have done more? Yes.

I have personally seen how Senator's eyes lit up when I said I am from IV and he was considerate to my questions.

Over the years, I have seen the futility of convincing people online to join the mass effort of IV. Either you get it or you don't. Individuals think they can out-think IV or force IV to pickup their pet cause. With the wealth of knowledge and close links that IV has, I would say IV has thought things from more angles than nearly all of them. More importantly, it exactly knows what it is the truth and what are media games and how the system works.

Just my two cents for its worth.

Suva
08-27-2014, 04:44 PM
White House considers proposals to sharply increase legal immigration - The Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/white-house-considers-proposals-to-sharply-increase-legal-immigration/2014/08/27/f808ffdc-2d23-11e4-bb9b-997ae96fad33_story.html)

Thanks

spicy_guy
08-27-2014, 04:50 PM
White House considers proposals to sharply increase legal immigration - The Washington Post (http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/white-house-considers-proposals-to-sharply-increase-legal-immigration/2014/08/27/f808ffdc-2d23-11e4-bb9b-997ae96fad33_story.html)

Thanks

Good grief! Even with possibilities, it has to pass through tough political climate!
Go IV!

spicy_guy
08-27-2014, 04:55 PM
Good grief! Even with possibilities, it has to pass through tough political climate!
Go IV!

Useful link from the above article...

http://archive.azcentral.com/ic/pdf/0623backofline.pdf

hil3182
08-27-2014, 06:20 PM
I have been to a couple of advocacy day events, never posted on the forum before because the quality of the conversation on an important matter has never been so poor.

All the noise about dependent exemption and green card recapture is just that - noise. The people asking for dependent exemption know that it is impossible. The main reason they are asking is the hope it will drown out more reasonable "asks" (in DC speak) like early filing of I-485 - which not co-incidentally the noise makers are completely silent about. Other reasons exist for the noise which I will not get into.

If you are wondering who the noisemakers are, all you have to do is figure out the losers with (say) the early I-485 fix (among our other asks). Immigration lawyers are an obvious suspect, hence the sight of them crawling out of the woodwork to opine on the dubious legality of the Dependent exemption - after not hearing a peep out of them on this matter in the last decade. Tech companies are another obvious suspect, we haven't heard any of them ask for anything other than more H1-B's, back door H1-B's, recapture and Dependent exemption.

Again, it is not a coincidence, that provisions which would benefit our community that the tech companies are making a noise about are unachievable "pie in the sky" asks.

You don't hear a peep about anything that is both achievable and would benefit us.

If you genuinely are on an H1 and want to see an improvement in your situation, you better hope and pray the dependent exemption and recapture noise does not drown out our more reasonable and achievable "asks" - which is exactly what the people that prey on us want.

abcdgc
08-27-2014, 06:55 PM
I have been to a couple of advocacy day events, never posted on the forum before because the quality of the conversation on an important matter has never been so poor.

All the noise about dependent exemption and green card recapture is just that - noise. The people asking for dependent exemption know that it is impossible. The main reason they are asking is the hope it will drown out more reasonable "asks" (in DC speak) like early filing of I-485 - which not co-incidentally the noise makers are completely silent about. Other reasons exist for the noise which I will not get into.

If you are wondering who the noisemakers are, all you have to do is figure out the losers with (say) the early I-485 fix (among our other asks). Immigration lawyers are an obvious suspect, hence the sight of them crawling out of the woodwork to opine on the dubious legality of the Dependent exemption - after not hearing a peep out of them on this matter in the last decade. Tech companies are another obvious suspect, we haven't heard any of them ask for anything other than more H1-B's, back door H1-B's, recapture and Dependent exemption.

Again, it is not a coincidence, that provisions which would benefit our community that the tech companies are making a noise about are unachievable "pie in the sky" asks.

You don't hear a peep about anything that is both achievable and would benefit us.

If you genuinely are on an H1 and want to see an improvement in your situation, you better hope and pray the dependent exemption and recapture noise does not drown out our more reasonable and achievable "asks" - which is exactly what the people that prey on us want.



Thank you for posting this. I couldn't have said it any better. Cannot thank you enough for putting in clear words. But don't hold your breath, the next guy asking "but why can't obama do recapture" is 52 seconds away. But the more dangerous guy who is only here to create negativity to poison the environment is only 18 seconds away.

gdgtgeek
08-27-2014, 07:13 PM
I have been to a couple of advocacy day events, never posted on the forum before because the quality of the conversation on an important matter has never been so poor.

All the noise about dependent exemption and green card recapture is just that - noise. The people asking for dependent exemption know that it is impossible. The main reason they are asking is the hope it will drown out more reasonable "asks" (in DC speak) like early filing of I-485 - which not co-incidentally the noise makers are completely silent about. Other reasons exist for the noise which I will not get into.

If you are wondering who the noisemakers are, all you have to do is figure out the losers with (say) the early I-485 fix (among our other asks). Immigration lawyers are an obvious suspect, hence the sight of them crawling out of the woodwork to opine on the dubious legality of the Dependent exemption - after not hearing a peep out of them on this matter in the last decade. Tech companies are another obvious suspect, we haven't heard any of them ask for anything other than more H1-B's, back door H1-B's, recapture and Dependent exemption.

Again, it is not a coincidence, that provisions which would benefit our community that the tech companies are making a noise about are unachievable "pie in the sky" asks.

You don't hear a peep about anything that is both achievable and would benefit us.

If you genuinely are on an H1 and want to see an improvement in your situation, you better hope and pray the dependent exemption and recapture noise does not drown out our more reasonable and achievable "asks" - which is exactly what the people that prey on us want.

This is a great perspective and I think it makes complete sense. Well said.

columbusdude007
08-27-2014, 07:30 PM
Here is an AP Report excerpt on Yahoo

"Obama's goal had been to announce his decision around Labor Day, before leaving on a trip next week to Estonia and Wales. But a host of national security crises have pushed the announcement back, likely until after Obama returns, said the officials, who weren't authorized to comment by name and demanded anonymity."

columbusdude007
08-27-2014, 10:53 PM
Check this out..

Cavuto Presses Gutierrez Quarrel On Immmigration | The Daily Caller (http://dailycaller.com/2014/08/27/cavuto-presses-gutierrez-on-executive-amnesty-you-know-exactly-whats-going-to-happen-video/)

AceMan
08-28-2014, 09:53 AM
I have been to a couple of advocacy day events, never posted on the forum before because the quality of the conversation on an important matter has never been so poor.

All the noise about dependent exemption and green card recapture is just that - noise. The people asking for dependent exemption know that it is impossible. The main reason they are asking is the hope it will drown out more reasonable "asks" (in DC speak) like early filing of I-485 - which not co-incidentally the noise makers are completely silent about. Other reasons exist for the noise which I will not get into.

If you are wondering who the noisemakers are, all you have to do is figure out the losers with (say) the early I-485 fix (among our other asks). Immigration lawyers are an obvious suspect, hence the sight of them crawling out of the woodwork to opine on the dubious legality of the Dependent exemption - after not hearing a peep out of them on this matter in the last decade. Tech companies are another obvious suspect, we haven't heard any of them ask for anything other than more H1-B's, back door H1-B's, recapture and Dependent exemption.

Again, it is not a coincidence, that provisions which would benefit our community that the tech companies are making a noise about are unachievable "pie in the sky" asks.

You don't hear a peep about anything that is both achievable and would benefit us.

If you genuinely are on an H1 and want to see an improvement in your situation, you better hope and pray the dependent exemption and recapture noise does not drown out our more reasonable and achievable "asks" - which is exactly what the people that prey on us want.

I concur. Pretty well said.

sunny2007
08-28-2014, 12:42 PM
I concur. Pretty well said. Guys on this topic, I think we should throw our support to "Compete America" instead , IV forum Members are of no use but thinking they are demigods.

Thanks.

greyhair
08-28-2014, 01:27 PM
Guys on this topic, I think we should throw our support to "Compete America" instead , IV forum Members are of no use but thinking they are demigods.

Thanks.

Do you ever think before opening your mouth? hil3182 just explained what is going on and you are suggesting exactly the opposite.

Possible Administrative Fixes - Filtering facts from fiction - Page 7 - Immigration Voice (http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/forum16-iv-agenda-and-legislative-updates/3096036-possible-administrative-fixes-filtering-facts-from-fiction-7.html#post3583023)

You are suggesting supporting companies who are screwing all of us. And who cares for your support any way? Did anybody call you to ask for your support? You are no one in this discussion other than posting silly messages online anonymously which no one cares for.

eastindia
08-28-2014, 02:00 PM
Guys on this topic, I think we should throw our support to "Compete America" instead , IV forum Members are of no use but thinking they are demigods.

Thanks.

Do you know IV is an important member on Compete America board?

And what exactly do you mean by 'throwing support'? What will you give them as 'support'? Can you please explain.

mantagon
08-28-2014, 03:07 PM
....he and other folks here who think alike have agreed to donate 50% of their monthly salary to 'Compete America' until the latter can get 'em their GREEN CARDS!! Yeah, then what!

Do you know IV is an important member on Compete America board?

And what exactly do you mean by 'throwing support'? What will you give them as 'support'? Can you please explain.

sunny2007
08-28-2014, 04:49 PM
Do you ever think before opening your mouth? hil3182 just explained what is going on and you are suggesting exactly the opposite.

Possible Administrative Fixes - Filtering facts from fiction - Page 7 - Immigration Voice (http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/forum16-iv-agenda-and-legislative-updates/3096036-possible-administrative-fixes-filtering-facts-from-fiction-7.html#post3583023)

You are suggesting supporting companies who are screwing all of us. And who cares for your support any way? Did anybody call you to ask for your support? You are no one in this discussion other than posting silly messages online anonymously which no one cares for. IV took donation right and return my 100 dollar donation then.

greyhair
08-28-2014, 07:45 PM
IV took donation right and return my 100 dollar donation then.

I am not giving you jack shit. Why are you asking me :rolleyes: go ask IV.

Ask IV why did they not get your and mine GC till now after taking your $100

abcdgc
08-28-2014, 08:33 PM
IV took donation right and return my 100 dollar donation then.

What took you so long? I thought you were suppose to be pissing all over the place like yesterday.

Why are you asking for $100, do you want to give it to technology companies who has enslaved everyone on H1B and L1 visa? They can use your $100 to lobby for getting more indentured servants like us. They have plenty of franklins to buy access to screw you million times over without you knowing it.

Why is it that now I notice more suckers on IV forum. More people vocal are negative and against their own agenda. Wonder if they had any real learning and education apart from getting a certificate.

Who will cut the branch of a tree while sitting on that same branch? Only a dumb or mad man

abcdgc
08-28-2014, 09:58 PM
Guys on this topic, I think we should throw our support to "Compete America" instead , IV forum Members are of no use but thinking they are demigods.

Thanks.

Seriously? I wonder where you learned to read and write. WAIT.... please don't tell, parents will stop sending their kid to that school.

throw our support? "Compete America"? Do you know who are these guys? Is it possible that these guys are the reason why your life is.... what is that word......hmmmmmm....... can't think of it...... FCUKED UP. This is like a blind (that is you) watching and admiring Kardashians (that is "Compete America")

shining
08-28-2014, 10:46 PM
Obama's lawyers prepare to defend executive action on immigration - CBS News (http://www.cbsnews.com/news/obamas-lawyers-prepare-to-defend-executive-action-on-immigration/)


1-Obama beefing up his lawyers and securing the legal front
and
2-buying more time --

. . . . so labor day anticipators --wait some more ---likely after the foreign trips

spicy_guy
08-29-2014, 10:27 AM
Obama's lawyers prepare to defend executive action on immigration - CBS News (http://www.cbsnews.com/news/obamas-lawyers-prepare-to-defend-executive-action-on-immigration/)


1-Obama beefing up his lawyers and securing the legal front
and
2-buying more time --

. . . . so labor day anticipators --wait some more ---likely after the foreign trips

At least a step forward!

Suva
08-29-2014, 12:54 PM
It seems counting dependents for legal immigrants is published in every news related to President's EO.

Obama's lawyers prepare to defend executive action on immigration - CBS News (http://www.cbsnews.com/news/obamas-lawyers-prepare-to-defend-executive-action-on-immigration/)

"Other options under consideration, such as changes to how green cards are distributed and counted, might be less controversial because they have been developed with input from the business community and other groups traditionally more aligned with Republicans. But Derrick Morgan, a former adviser to Vice President Dick Cheney and a scholar at the conservative Heritage Foundation, said Mr. Obama will still face staunch opposition as long as he attempts an end run around Congress."

Thanks

amulchandra
08-29-2014, 01:14 PM
It seems counting dependents for legal immigrants is published in every news related to President's EO.

Obama's lawyers prepare to defend executive action on immigration - CBS News (http://www.cbsnews.com/news/obamas-lawyers-prepare-to-defend-executive-action-on-immigration/)

"Other options under consideration, such as changes to how green cards are distributed and counted, might be less controversial because they have been developed with input from the business community and other groups traditionally more aligned with Republicans. But Derrick Morgan, a former adviser to Vice President Dick Cheney and a scholar at the conservative Heritage Foundation, said Mr. Obama will still face staunch opposition as long as he attempts an end run around Congress."

Thanks
Looks like EO will be delayed until after November midterms as per this article.

Obama suggests he'll need more time on immigration policy - LA Times (http://www.latimes.com/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-obama-immigration-policy-20140829-story.html)

shining
08-29-2014, 04:40 PM
It seems counting dependents for legal immigrants is published in every news related to President's EO.


Based on various articles, including this one . . . . I think the resistance against EO is because of amnesty and legalizing 6+Million folks. On the legal front, so far have not seen any major resistance coming from any major groups . . . So even if it gets challenged either by way of CBO funding cessation or legal suit ---it appears to more toward the legalization part vs. the counting part of the derivatives ---because republicans would either way support that as the top businesses and top lobby houses are all in for that---

Maybe my friday or the long weekend optimism doing the talking here---

Timing wise, yes it does appear that doing this in November is more plausible politically --and the whole point of this is the political gridlock --so some groups/folks would pursue that as a weakness if Obama does not take an EO prior to the end of summer

Cheers
Shining

sunny2007
08-29-2014, 05:59 PM
Seriously? I wonder where you learned to read and write. WAIT.... please don't tell, parents will stop sending their kid to that school.

throw our support? "Compete America"? Do you know who are these guys? Is it possible that these guys are the reason why your life is.... what is that word......hmmmmmm....... can't think of it...... FCUKED UP. This is like a blind (that is you) watching and admiring Kardashians (that is "Compete America") Morons on this board know only to attack people.

If IV is not interested to support this initiative , then you go to whoever is ready to fight for the cause. You filthy scumbags can stay in the line forever.

Good Bye.

sunny2007
08-29-2014, 06:24 PM
I am not giving you jack shit. Why are you asking me :rolleyes: go ask IV.

Ask IV why did they not get your and mine GC till now after taking your $100 Greyhair : Who told you I'm waiting for my GC ? You are speaking as if you are spokesperson of IV. You are a bug on this forum.

sunny2007
08-30-2014, 01:21 AM
What took you so long? I thought you were suppose to be pissing all over the place like yesterday.

Why are you asking for $100, do you want to give it to technology companies who has enslaved everyone on H1B and L1 visa? They can use your $100 to lobby for getting more indentured servants like us. They have plenty of franklins to buy access to screw you million times over without you knowing it.

Why is it that now I notice more suckers on IV forum. More people vocal are negative and against their own agenda. Wonder if they had any real learning and education apart from getting a certificate.

Who will cut the branch of a tree while sitting on that same branch? Only a dumb or mad man You Jackass , mind your words.

columbusdude007
08-30-2014, 10:28 AM
White House: Nation Needs Debate Before Obama Amnesty | The Daily Caller (http://dailycaller.com/2014/08/29/white-house-national-debate-needed-before-obama-amnesty/)

Murthy
08-30-2014, 12:02 PM
White House: Nation Needs Debate Before Obama Amnesty | The Daily Caller (http://dailycaller.com/2014/08/29/white-house-national-debate-needed-before-obama-amnesty/)

This is what IV core Aman and other are trying to explain. Not possible with in the frame work of existing law. Let us not fight each other.

whiteStallion
08-31-2014, 02:09 PM
Is it really delayed again or is it just noise ?

shining
08-31-2014, 10:24 PM
Not just the noise --its definitely delayed --interesting politically charged curveball . . .

Tarang
09-04-2014, 11:56 PM
Admins,

Please share your take on EO (atleast what you can on public forum). Dont see any positive indications in media lately.

columbusdude007
09-05-2014, 09:35 AM
This is what IV core Aman and other are trying to explain. Not possible with in the frame work of existing law. Let us not fight each other.
What the News Report is saying and what IV is saying are totally different.

dkshitij
09-05-2014, 02:11 PM
Recent media headlines

Obama: Immigration announcement 'soon' (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2014/09/05/obama-immigration-election-day/15130029/)

President Obama indicated Friday he might take executive action on immigration before the November congressional elections, but made no commitments on timing or specifics.

Speaking to reporters at the end of a NATO summit in Wales, Obama said he has begun receiving immigration recommendations from Attorney General Eric Holder and Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson.

"I suspect that on my flight back, this'll be part of my reading, taking a look at some of the specifics that we've looked at," Obama said. "And I'll be making an announcement soon."


and some policy analysis

http://nfap.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/NFAP-Policy-Brief.Executive-Action.Sept-2014.pdf

This is just whats out in the media. Please do not take it as the real thing or as something endorsed by IV. They may just be noise.

spicy_guy
09-06-2014, 11:21 AM
Recent media headlines

Obama: Immigration announcement 'soon' (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2014/09/05/obama-immigration-election-day/15130029/)




and some policy analysis

http://nfap.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/NFAP-Policy-Brief.Executive-Action.Sept-2014.pdf

This is just whats out in the media. Please do not take it as the real thing or as something endorsed by IV. They may just be noise.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/07/us/politics/obama-said-to-delay-executive-action-on-immigration.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&_r=0


Final good bye!!!

Tarang
09-06-2014, 11:21 AM
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/07/us/politics/obama-said-to-delay-executive-action-on-immigration.html?_r=0

Administrator2
09-06-2014, 02:15 PM
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/09/07/us/politics/obama-said-to-delay-executive-action-on-immigration.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&_r=0


Final good bye!!!


We have waited for long time and a few weeks here or there won't make much difference in the grand scheme of things.

I would suggest not looking at this from the point of election season but look at it from the point of view of Administration's desire to do something. No body is saying this is over and it won't happen. Fatalist approach is not healthy so it won't be wise to read it that way. It is matter of when not if this will happen. So keep it positive because the intention is do EO and we can all live with few weeks here or there.

Administrator2
09-06-2014, 02:41 PM
And anybody accusing the President of playing politics is not living is the real world. There is nothing non-political about politically charged subject of immigration. The business of Washington is politics. So it is ironic for a few to accuse the President for "playing politics".

Ask yourself, if you were President, will you do something to encourage switching of the Senate to the other party? Or will you not wait for a few weeks until after the election? It is easy to be carried away when one is inundated with often biased news/opinions. But it is most important to be smart and see through information thrown at us, more so when it is needed the most.

shining
09-07-2014, 03:37 AM
And anybody accusing the President of playing politics is not living is the real world. There is nothing non-political about politically charged subject of immigration. The business of Washington is politics. So it is ironic for a few to accuse the President for "playing politics".


Agreed --its all about resilience --

Cheers
Shining

sengs
09-07-2014, 01:01 PM
Is this delay in EO from White house also going to affect the H4 EAD provision that was announced in spring 2014?

spicy_guy
09-08-2014, 10:41 AM
We have waited for long time and a few weeks here or there won't make much difference in the grand scheme of things.

I would suggest not looking at this from the point of election season but look at it from the point of view of Administration's desire to do something. No body is saying this is over and it won't happen. Fatalist approach is not healthy so it won't be wise to read it that way. It is matter of when not if this will happen. So keep it positive because the intention is do EO and we can all live with few weeks here or there.

Agree!

Its from the usual smell that we had been through for the past 2-3 years, "all hoopla but no action" sort of sentiment.

You are right in saying, "We have waited....". We can wait for couple more months. Hopefully something +ve would emerge.

gten
09-08-2014, 02:37 PM
And anybody accusing the President of playing politics is not living is the real world. There is nothing non-political about politically charged subject of immigration. The business of Washington is politics. So it is ironic for a few to accuse the President for "playing politics".

Ask yourself, if you were President, will you do something to encourage switching of the Senate to the other party? Or will you not wait for a few weeks until after the election? It is easy to be carried away when one is inundated with often biased news/opinions. But it is most important to be smart and see through information thrown at us, more so when it is needed the most.

Totally agree with you Aman. DACA was issued before re-election. It helped him politically to get re-elected. Right now, Obama and Democrats believe that EO on immigration will do them more harm than good in mid-terms. Immigration is a hot political topic and both parties want to benefit from it. So, I don't think Obama will do anything after mid-term. He will wait till 2016 to take action and possibly help get another Democrat president in white house. What's his political motivation to act on EO after the mid-terms? He will blame GOP or something else to delay it till 2016. John Boehner has already started the conversation that CIR "might" be possible in 2015.. like he said in 2013 and again in 2014. GOP will also try their best to buy time and pass something in House to improve their image before 2016 election.

While we agree the president want to do something to help fix immigration, I think he will only do it if it helps him politically or helps his legacy. He can/will act close to 2016 elections to do that.

Aman, can you share your thoughts on this? Why do you think he will act in Nov. after mid-terms?

Thanks.

Fellow IV members - I am just sharing my view point. Spare me the speech on "What I have done to contribute?", "Have I taken part in any advocacy events?", etc.

bsnf
09-08-2014, 03:45 PM
Immigration reform: Elect GOP president (Opinion) - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2014/09/08/opinion/navarrette-obama-immigration-reform-republican/index.html?hpt=hp_t3)

CNN predicting that EA will be put off until next Presidential election - I hope they are wrong

eastindia
09-08-2014, 04:26 PM
Immigration reform: Elect GOP president (Opinion) - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2014/09/08/opinion/navarrette-obama-immigration-reform-republican/index.html?hpt=hp_t3)

CNN predicting that EA will be put off until next Presidential election - I hope they are wrong

Everything written on the internet is not true. Everything written in news is also not true. You can have diverse news items in the 2 channels in the same country. News is also all not honest. It could be a lobbied news. You also need to be smart about seeing that is is not CNN saying. You are wrong in that. It is not a CNN news. It is an opinion. Anyone can have an opinion. Now you should also see who is having an opinion here? The author is known to be writing in favor of Hispanics for past many years. So he will try to paint a picture that helps the cause of earliest action. We need to be smart and read between the lines.

gk_2000
09-08-2014, 08:18 PM
EO aside -- does it impact the admin fixes? Does it hasten or make worse the EAD action in any way?

aashishkapoor
09-08-2014, 10:41 PM
Hello All, Do you know will these delay impact on EAD for H4 admin fix ?

Thanks

shining
09-13-2014, 12:50 AM
White House chief of staff Denis McDonough pledged to Latino lawmakers during a private meeting Thursday that President Barack Obama will take executive action on immigration before the holidays are over – an effort to soothe lawmakers furious about the administration’s move to hold off on action.

Read more: W.H. talks immigration with Latino lawmakers - Seung Min Kim - POLITICO.com (http://www.politico.com/story/2014/09/white-house-immigration-latino-lawmakers-110871.html#ixzz3DAVxvNhz)

greendream26
09-19-2014, 12:14 PM
Please delete this post from here is its irrelevant!!! I thought because this H4 EAD rule is going to be part of the administrative fixes it would be wise to have it in this forum.

Hi All,
I am trying to get my wife a US Masters Degree so that she can get a job and can work. This said she is in the middle of her Masters which she is doing on H4 and we are on the verge of final steps to decide if we should convert to F1 so that she can utilize OPT later for the Job search.

Do you think its wise to transfer to F1 > OPT > H1b?? OR wait for H4 EAD rule??

Please suggest!!!

gs1968
10-13-2014, 02:54 PM
Just to keep the thread alive-can anyone shed more light on what the President meant in these remarks?
I am sure the President knows the difference between the H-1b program and Green Cards

Obama H-1B reform plan draws Grassley's ire | Computerworld (http://www.computerworld.com/article/2825254/obama-h-1b-reform-plan-draws-grassleys-ire.html)

Administrator2
10-13-2014, 09:19 PM
Just to keep the thread alive-can anyone shed more light on what the President meant in these remarks?
I am sure the President knows the difference between the H-1b program and Green Cards

Obama H-1B reform plan draws Grassley's ire | Computerworld (http://www.computerworld.com/article/2825254/obama-h-1b-reform-plan-draws-grassleys-ire.html)

Thanks for sharing the article and bumping the thread. Much of the work happens in the real world, out of the forums or online discussions. Yes, we believe that President knows the difference and things are getting into crunch time. You will see many different articles and opinions as time progress, so hand-in tight before it all unfolds.

indianguy220
10-14-2014, 10:27 AM
Thanks for sharing the article and bumping the thread. Much of the work happens in the real world, out of the forums or online discussions. Yes, we believe that President knows the difference and things are getting into crunch time. You will see many different articles and opinions as time progress, so hand-in tight before it all unfolds.

Admin, do you still think H4 EAD would happen or is it now dependent on EO. I always thought that H4 EAD is taking its own course as part of rule making process and now I see a lot of people saying it would be part of EO etc.

There are a lot like me whose life tremendously improves with such changes(H4 EAD) in the short term while we realize the bigger changes will take time to make.

Thanks for all the effort behind the scenes.

kichoudh
10-14-2014, 09:39 PM
IV Team -- Thanks for all your efforts. I have tried to play my part by donating periodically to IV so that you guys can continue your advocacy efforts.

From your website the paypal donation was not working. I had to send a check via mail.

dipdowndust
10-15-2014, 12:37 PM
http://www.grassley.senate.gov/sites/default/files/judiciary/upload/Immigration%2C%2010-10-14%2C%20Executive%20action%2C%20letter%20to%20Pres ident.pdf

Could this doom EO for legal immigration just like HR 3012 ?

greendream26
10-20-2014, 07:18 PM
Exclusive: Obama Administration Quietly Prepares 'Surge' Of Millions Of New Immigrant IDs (http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/10/19/Exclusive-Obama-Admin-Quietly-Prepares-Surge-Of-Millions-Of-Immigrant-IDs)

Does this mean everything for illegal immigrants and nothing for legally?? Millions of illegals and only 140,000 legals?? That too not sure??

2008candid
10-20-2014, 10:12 PM
These are just media report, most probably exaggerated by GOP.

imh1b
10-20-2014, 10:15 PM
Exclusive: Obama Administration Quietly Prepares 'Surge' Of Millions Of New Immigrant IDs (http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2014/10/19/Exclusive-Obama-Admin-Quietly-Prepares-Surge-Of-Millions-Of-Immigrant-IDs)

Does this mean everything for illegal immigrants and nothing for legally?? Millions of illegals and only 140,000 legals?? That too not sure??

Legals are getting what they most want. You see almost 50% legals (all spouses) want H4s able to get work permit. They are getting it. The remaining people are divided between countries. All countries except India do not have a long wait time. So that leaves us with a smaller percentage of people. In that small minority of non dependent Indians, many are porting to EB2 and are mostly happy. Almost all EB2 want a non existant EB1C fraud stopped. They spend all their energies on posting about it or watching visa bulletins. So they really do not want anything from President except EB1C fraud stopping and ban on porting.

That finally leaves a very tiny minority of EB3 non-dependent Indians that cannot port. Their energies are spent in trying to find some porting option or accepting their fate. They are mostly burned out waiting and will not do anything.

You will say every year new people come or want to come as students, dependents, tourists wanting H1B, H4 wanting H1B, students wanting H1B, J1 wanting H1B etc. This is a big majority and they all want H1B. For them President is already working on increasing the H1B quota and ending lottery system so that everyone can get H1B.

This is a win win for all legal immigrants because every legal group kind of gets something. From economy perspective, more H1B is more good for economy than greencards. Imagine if companies can employ bright talented professionals at a reduced rate for more number of hours. They will also not leave the job. This is great for the economy. It is also great for lawyers who will get more clients to file H1B every year and renewals.

It is hard to please everyone but by and large all legal people should rejoice at the upcoming reforms. They are getting a lot more than they worked for.

greendream26
10-20-2014, 10:35 PM
Legals are getting what they most want. You see almost 50% legals (all spouses) want H4s able to get work permit. They are getting it. The remaining people are divided between countries. All countries except India do not have a long wait time. So that leaves us with a smaller percentage of people. In that small minority of non dependent Indians, many are porting to EB2 and are mostly happy. Almost all EB2 want a non existant EB1C fraud stopped.

Nice points..... But say for example someone from EB3 gets out of status and becomes illegal, he/she can instantaneously get GC. Which is far far better than getting GC thru the regular process.

Here we are talking about 4 million illegals getting GC. Removing dependents from counting for eb categories is a awesome step, no doubt. But still any person with priority date anytime in 2014 or 2013 can't expect to be current within couple of months of this news. But illegals being so huge still can expect it.

Seniors can correct me if wrong. At the end of the day we are not denying that legals are not getting what they want. But the speed of getting will still be slower than illegals. In other words be illegal u will definitely be rewarded.

imh1b
10-21-2014, 09:08 AM
Nice points..... But say for example someone from EB3 gets out of status and becomes illegal, he/she can instantaneously get GC. Which is far far better than getting GC thru the regular process.

This is a misconception. if that is true what is stopping all legals to throw their passport away and join the line to get greencard. Undocumented are merely getting a document that allows them to work and get in the system. Compare it with EAD that even all legals are also getting. If someone thinks undocumented are getting a better deal there is noone stopping them to join the undocumented line today.

Here we are talking about 4 million illegals getting GC. Removing dependents from counting for eb categories is a awesome step, no doubt. But still any person with priority date anytime in 2014 or 2013 can't expect to be current within couple of months of this news. But illegals being so huge still can expect it.Undocumented are not getting immediate greencard. It is going to be a long process for them. But again if any legal thinks they are better off joining undocumented, there is no reason to stop them join the other line. In fact if reform is for undocumented you should expect every legal to join the undocumented line. But this is not going to happen. Because what you said is a good point in a post but in reality we all know the benefit of staying legal is far more than becoming undocumented. Try living a life of undocumented for a day. It is life of fear and uncertainty. Even if they get EAD life will be hard for them. The line for 14 million to get greencard is going to be very long.

Seniors can correct me if wrong. At the end of the day we are not denying that legals are not getting what they want. But the speed of getting will still be slower than illegals. In other words be illegal u will definitely be rewarded.

You are mistaken. But let me clear it further. There is actually no difference between legal and illegal from a capitalist standpoint. The difference exist only in the mind of legals and this word is thrown by decision makers and corporates only to further their interests. In actuality both categories are just 'workers' at the end of the day. If agriculture industry is in desperate need for workers, they will not hire H1B computer programmers to work on fields. They will get agriculture undocumented workers asap and get greencards from government asap. This is a much higher level of policy planning that most legals do not understand because they are either so busy with their job, still trying to understand the country and not assimilated yet.... or simply watching their foreign country channels and news despite wanting to get a greencard in this country. There is a bigger capitalist culture at play and laws are made based on that.

greendream26
10-21-2014, 09:57 AM
This is a misconception. if that is true what is stopping all legals to throw their passport away and join the line to get greencard.

Thanks a lot for your valuable time in writing 2 long posts and it helps understanding a lot more. You are right we IT folks have a tough time understanding the bigger picture and only look behind selfish motives. But in short your explanation and well written post makes my mind clear that watever we are getting is better than we expect and its still better than getting nothing.

Once again awesome replies from you and THANKS ONCE AGAIN for your time!!! :):)

imh1b
10-21-2014, 10:33 AM
Thanks a lot for your valuable time in writing 2 long posts and it helps understanding a lot more. You are right we IT folks have a tough time understanding the bigger picture and only look behind selfish motives. But in short your explanation and well written post makes my mind clear that watever we are getting is better than we expect and its still better than getting nothing.

Once again awesome replies from you and THANKS ONCE AGAIN for your time!!! :):)

Thank you for your appreciation and understanding my points.

Taking the post further I feel most of us do not really know whom we should blame for the long wait time of greencard. Some of us blame government, some blame lawyers, some companies , some people blame laws, some people other ethinic group for coming in huge number and some narrow minded even talk about blaming visa carryover rule change, some blame some organization etc. While I agree there are big sharks out there like companies that take advantage, lawyers that file slow for employers so that employee stays longer, websites that see a threat if their traffic gets greencard and thus will not be able to make money from advertising when people track cases, businesses that own such websites to sell their products that are fishy and so on.

People fail to understand the real reason for their sorrow and how they can overcome it. IN a capitalist economy where everything is driven by business interest, and democracy allows legal ways of lobbying, lobbying is the only way for us. We do not own multi million industries. But we can certainly have an organization , pool lot of money and spend on lobbying. This is one and only one option left for us. For that we will need constant flow of money because lobbying takes time to show results. Fortunately there is immigrationvoice.org to do that but legal immigrants are not woken up yet to this side of American democracy.

greendream26
10-21-2014, 10:57 AM
Thank you for your appreciation and understanding my points.

Taking the post further I feel most of us do not really know whom we should blame for the long wait time of greencard.



Sure. But do you know when is Obama releasing all the details? We do know it will be between 4th November to christmas BUT any more specific than these?
Has the press, AILA, immigrationvoice.ord invited for a event. Dont laugh if my question is funny. ;)

imh1b
10-21-2014, 11:11 AM
Sure. But do you know when is Obama releasing all the details? We do know it will be between 4th November to christmas BUT any more specific than these?
Has the press, AILA, immigrationvoice.ord invited for a event. Dont laugh if my question is funny. ;)

Your information on timing is correct as per media news.
I am sure as always Press. Immigrationvoice.org will be invited for the event. Not sure if lawyers are that powerful enough. They do not represent immigrants. And companies are represented by companies themselves in lobbying. Lawyers only represent themselves and there interest lies in more backlog and more people getting documented to increase business. I fail to understand why many of us think lawyers are some powerful lobby. Maybe there is lot of facade being created on internet and people cannot see through it. But I know from friends who are active with Immigration voice that government has regular meetings with the organization to discuss. So we should be happy that there is someone representing our interest. The problem is we are not not strong in resources. We should have been doing political dinners and election campaigns to get more close to US politics.

greendream26
10-21-2014, 02:11 PM
Your information on timing is correct as per media news.
I am sure as always Press. Immigrationvoice.org will be invited for the event. Not sure if lawyers are that powerful enough.

Thanks for sharing whatever you know. :-)
If whatever expected for backlogs is delivered by Obama than what do we think about the backlogs being current in 2015, 2016 or take longer than that for all EB categories? OR do you think everything would be current for a month and they would close all lines after that? repeat of 2007?

Excuse me for the above question, I am not very good at all this but always see people doing huge calcs which makes next to zero sense to me. I am not the best as you alll......:rolleyes:

imh1b
10-21-2014, 02:49 PM
Thanks for sharing whatever you know. :-)
If whatever expected for backlogs is delivered by Obama than what do we think about the backlogs being current in 2015, 2016 or take longer than that for all EB categories? OR do you think everything would be current for a month and they would close all lines after that? repeat of 2007?

Excuse me for the above question, I am not very good at all this but always see people doing huge calcs which makes next to zero sense to me. I am not the best as you alll......:rolleyes:

I think you are asking the same question someone asked after a Ramayan story was narrated. He wanted to know who Sita was. :D

All my posts above pointed to how meaningless the huge calculations people do. It takes away oxygen from the real solution to the problem and that is lobbying. The data available is not accurate. Approvals are not FIFO but still people track the person who signed their UPS application package. When you see those threads you begin to think if you are part of a category of people who call themselves best and the brightest.

The point I am making for you is it does not matter if backlog clears in 2015 or 2015 or never. EO is not made for that. People are thinking that someone signs petition or publishes a story in media and backlog will clear. It is not so. There is zero interest in clearing or creating a backlog for the powers that be. So trying to figure out if 'my' application will clear in Nov 2015 or May 2016 is moot and a waste of time. The reason is at a policy level what matters is what helps economy. What helps economy is what corporates ask. It means what the top firms want. Can you tell me if you have read them discussing clearing backlog 2015, 2016 or take longer or repeat of 2007? if you have not heard then it will not happen.

Coming back to people who calculate. If you read this post and last couple of posts again you will know they are not your heroes but the dumbest people of best and brightest group. Amen.

imh1b
10-21-2014, 03:12 PM
If you dig deeper you will see that what is see is not what you get. The real legal immigration issue is lack of available H1B numbers per year. Greencard backlog is NOT an issue. There is no study done on how increasing greencard will boost economy but there are many studies on how increasing H1B will boost economy. These studies are not done just morning. Someone saw a good reason in the idea and funded them. Greencard backlog or for that matter H4 issue is also not a human right issue that many spouses have misconception.

H4 EAD is being given for the reason that more workers will be brought to labor market who can work for less money and still be temporary. This temporary status will make them work hard to keep their status. The irony is that many spouses think 'H4 is a curse' and they want EAD. They will delete your post if you talk to them to ask for Greencard that is complete freedom or join Immigration voice. The level of intelligence is missing because most immigrants only mix in their native crowd and talk abut issues of their native country instead of being involved in US politics.

So what you will get is what increases number of workers. Best and the brightest already come through EB1 visa. EB2 and EB3 visas are mostly for 'workers'. Some exceptions are doctors or Research scientists who could not get EB1. But by and large EB2 and EB3 are 'workers; and they are needed in large numbers and temporary.

This is why I said temporary workers are getting the best deal they deserve and should rejoice. There is no other chance in the coming years for them to get anything by doing nothing.

2008candid
10-21-2014, 07:25 PM
If you dig deeper you will see that what is see is not what you get. The real legal immigration issue is lack of available H1B numbers per year. Greencard backlog is NOT an issue. There is no study done on how increasing greencard will boost economy but there are many studies on how increasing H1B will boost economy. These studies are not done just morning. Someone saw a good reason in the idea and funded them. Greencard backlog or for that matter H4 issue is also not a human right issue that many spouses have misconception.

H4 EAD is being given for the reason that more workers will be brought to labor market who can work for less money and still be temporary. This temporary status will make them work hard to keep their status. The irony is that many spouses think 'H4 is a curse' and they want EAD. They will delete your post if you talk to them to ask for Greencard that is complete freedom or join Immigration voice. The level of intelligence is missing because most immigrants only mix in their native crowd and talk abut issues of their native country instead of being involved in US politics.

So what you will get is what increases number of workers. Best and the brightest already come through EB1 visa. EB2 and EB3 visas are mostly for 'workers'. Some exceptions are doctors or Research scientists who could not get EB1. But by and large EB2 and EB3 are 'workers; and they are needed in large numbers and temporary.

This is why I said temporary workers are getting the best deal they deserve and should rejoice. There is no other chance in the coming years for them to get anything by doing nothing.

I love this post. I falls under the unfortunate 'worker category'. I really hope that EO( if it happens) will include provision to file EAD upon 140 approval. I am not that fan of EAD for H4..

imh1b
10-22-2014, 09:16 AM
I love this post. I falls under the unfortunate 'worker category'. I really hope that EO( if it happens) will include provision to file EAD upon 140 approval. I am not that fan of EAD for H4..

Thank you for reading my last few posts. I tried to explain.

I think your expectation of EAD after I140 is flawed. If you read my posts you will know why EAD after 140 has not happened in so many years.

To understand the reason, ask yourself how giving EAD after I140 will help large US corporates. It does not really matter if you and me are for or against EAD aupon I140 or EAD for H4.

But if Immigrationvoice.org can make a strong case for us, then we can surely expect this miracle to happen.

2008candid
10-27-2014, 08:46 AM
Posting just to keep this thread active and hope alive.
An another forum is so active with high hopes, just wondering if IV has any insight of EO?

greendream26
10-27-2014, 11:55 AM
Posting just to keep this thread active and hope alive.
An another forum is so active with high hopes, just wondering if IV has any insight of EO?

Which forum? Link?

eastindia
10-27-2014, 12:43 PM
Posting just to keep this thread active and hope alive.
An another forum is so active with high hopes, just wondering if IV has any insight of EO?

I have been to so many forums and must say that the inside information I get on Immigrationvoice can never be found on any other site. But here updates are only given sparingly and you have to look at website and also immigrationvoice facebook page for information. You will mostly find rumors and speculations elsewhere. Nobody has the kind of access that Immigrationvoice has. Being active with high hopes that have no basis or inside information has no meaning for me. My time is limited for gossip. It only helps their business so that more people can come to their for-profit websites.

greyhair
10-29-2014, 01:30 AM
A must read for everyone here. Excellent article on the subject at hand

https://beta.cironline.org/reports/job-brokers-steal-wages-entrap-indian-tech-workers-in-us/

imh1b
10-31-2014, 10:11 AM
A must read for everyone here. Excellent article on the subject at hand

https://beta.cironline.org/reports/job-brokers-steal-wages-entrap-indian-tech-workers-in-us/


Firstly thank you for posting it.

Secondly I really wonder why nobody on this forum and even on other websites are not discussing this. For them calculating the next bulletin is more important or maybe they are also part of this fraud. They come to this country but hook or crook and cry fowl when they get a better option. So a part of me says I guess its good, if these fraud immigrants are badly treated. But I know its a bad thing to say. Fraud is a disease in H1B, EAD, H4, L1 community and it is high time it is cured. It is more important than getting greencard or H4 ability to work. If the system is clean, there will no backlog and even genuine qualified H4 will get H1B visas. Currently most H4s are just waiting to get work permit so that they can join these fraud consulting firms. And those who are not IT based can fake resume and can even get a tester role.

"But a loophole inserted amid heavy industry lobbying allowed companies to sue the departing workers for financial damages.

TechServe Alliance, the lobbying organization that represents technology labor brokers, took credit on its website for blocking “the most onerous proposals” in the 1998 bill, saving employers from “burdensome new regulations.”

By allowing labor brokers to recoup costs incurred when workers quit, the law enabled them to disguise illegal penalties, critics say." Is an important info. These guys are no big, but could put in resources and also have a PAC. PAC gives them more leg room to lobby. If you look at their events they are active at chapter level too. One would think that if these slimy guys could do this how come our folks are not united and active against this disease before and even after getting green cards. It seems like a just cause to rid the program of bad apples that bring disrepute to the whole system.

Why is nobody talking about it? Why is other media houses quiet about it? Why are big companies like Google, Microsoft, Apple not talking about it? I do not know really.

snthampi
10-31-2014, 01:55 PM
Firstly thank you for posting it.

Secondly I really wonder why nobody on this forum and even on other websites are not discussing this. For them calculating the next bulletin is more important or maybe they are also part of this fraud. They come to this country but hook or crook and cry fowl when they get a better option. So a part of me says I guess its good, if these fraud immigrants are badly treated. But I know its a bad thing to say. Fraud is a disease in H1B, EAD, H4, L1 community and it is high time it is cured. It is more important than getting greencard or H4 ability to work. If the system is clean, there will no backlog and even genuine qualified H4 will get H1B visas. Currently most H4s are just waiting to get work permit so that they can join these fraud consulting firms. And those who are not IT based can fake resume and can even get a tester role.

"But a loophole inserted amid heavy industry lobbying allowed companies to sue the departing workers for financial damages.

TechServe Alliance, the lobbying organization that represents technology labor brokers, took credit on its website for blocking “the most onerous proposals” in the 1998 bill, saving employers from “burdensome new regulations.”

By allowing labor brokers to recoup costs incurred when workers quit, the law enabled them to disguise illegal penalties, critics say." Is an important info. These guys are no big, but could put in resources and also have a PAC. PAC gives them more leg room to lobby. If you look at their events they are active at chapter level too. One would think that if these slimy guys could do this how come our folks are not united and active against this disease before and even after getting green cards. It seems like a just cause to rid the program of bad apples that bring disrepute to the whole system.

Why is nobody talking about it? Why is other media houses quiet about it? Why are big companies like Google, Microsoft, Apple not talking about it? I do not know really.

The fraud is starting from the people who are defrauded, most of the time. Why would someone take up a job for 40-45K, if they have the skills required for a high skilled work visa? The obvious reason is that these people are coming in with fake resumes, proxy interviews, etc. I am sure some legitimate people get victimized too. But, that is just collateral damage. A significant percent of people who come here on H1 are not truly qualified. I have personally met people at work places that don't have the skills that they claim to have. I have heard many many stories through friends. I have heard people taking up jobs for which they don't have the skills and pay someone else in the team to do the work. The reference to Osmanabad University and the mentality of those students speaks volumes about what to expect. If only people with the right skills and qualifications are given H1 and L1 visas, EB2 and EB3 India wouldn't be backlogged this much.

A very very small percent of these fraud cases mentioned in this article have come to light because most of the time the immigrant settles it out with the fraud company because they themselves have a lot of baggage.

If you say these stuff to anyone in the Indian community, they will call you a traitor.

Why would Microsoft and Apple care if they can get cheap work force? There is no reason to believe that anything is going to change.

imh1b
10-31-2014, 02:19 PM
More of this

Watching Silicon Valley's "Body Shop" Secret

Silicon Valley's "Body Shop" Secret: Highly Educated Foreign Workers Treated Like Indentured Servants | NBC Bay Area (http://www.nbcbayarea.com/investigations/Silicon-Valleys-Body-Shop-Secret-280567322.html)

greyhair
11-01-2014, 12:17 PM
The fraud is starting from the people who are defrauded, most of the time. Why would someone take up a job for 40-45K, if they have the skills required for a high skilled work visa? The obvious reason is that these people are coming in with fake resumes, proxy interviews, etc. I am sure some legitimate people get victimized too. But, that is just collateral damage. A significant percent of people who come here on H1 are not truly qualified. I have personally met people at work places that don't have the skills that they claim to have. I have heard many many stories through friends. I have heard people taking up jobs for which they don't have the skills and pay someone else in the team to do the work. The reference to Osmanabad University and the mentality of those students speaks volumes about what to expect. If only people with the right skills and qualifications are given H1 and L1 visas, EB2 and EB3 India wouldn't be backlogged this much.

A very very small percent of these fraud cases mentioned in this article have come to light because most of the time the immigrant settles it out with the fraud company because they themselves have a lot of baggage.

If you say these stuff to anyone in the Indian community, they will call you a traitor.

Why would Microsoft and Apple care if they can get cheap work force? There is no reason to believe that anything is going to change.

People against removing slavery in America often blamed African Americans. They often said that:
- "look at how blacks dress" - Not acknowledging that African Americans were poor and were not allowed to own property.
- "they have no education or look at how they talk" - Not acknowledging that African Americans were not immigrants and not allowed education.
- Or "look at how they behave or look or their moral are low"
And the list goes on.

No matter what you say, you cannot blame African Americans for slavery in America. Likewise, you cannot blame immigrants on H1/L1 for the slavery style system in America, a system protected and promoted by large technology companies (including the companies that many revere) and preserved by US Congress.

If immigrants are exploited by their employer and employer is not giving immigration paper work, will immigrants not take desperate measures to change and go to another employer? Is that wrong to take desperate measures to avoid exploitation? The current system is so heavily tilted in favor of the employer that if employer won't give you pay stubs, experience letters, H1 document, copies of green card petition - then it is so difficult to change employer. And 99.99% employers follow the practice that they will not give one or the other document to their immigrant employees.

Is it wrong for employees on H1/L1 to take desperate measures including padding resume, just so they can avoid the exploitation of their current employer? Even law allows to kill someone else in self defense, but some purist will make everyone on H1 and L1 believe that what we go through is somehow our fault or as Microsoft CEO Satya might like to call it "karma". This is bullshit.

It doesn't matter what is the degree, qualification or caliber of H1/L1 immigrant. What matters in any system is if the employee has the freedom to change employer.

Even someone with PhD will be subjected to exploitation in a corrupt system if:
1.) she/he is working in an system that makes it difficult for her/him to change employer and the system is heavily tilted in favor of the employer.
2.) employer wants to exploit their employee, and it could be because of any reason including - just because the law allows the employer to conduct itself in unethical manner.

There I take exception to your statement that:
The fraud is starting from the people who are defrauded
Because it is not applicable in the current H1/L1 employee context.

Employees on H1/L1 are cowards, not frauds. They are suffering from apathy for the lives of their own children, but they are not frauds. They are not civilized enough for wanting to live free in a civilized society because they will not speak up, but not frauds. Unwilling to speak-up for their rights and unaware of the wrongs being caused to their families, but not frauds.

And the proof is, people on H1/L1 are unwilling to talk about this honest article. When oppressed or exploited people are unwilling to take on truth head-on, that is weakness, and no system can change with weakness.

If you talk 1-1 with people in desi parties, everyone will tell you their story of how they are being exploited by their employer, but not many people are willing to come forward to tell their real story.

So I take exception to your statement implying that H1/L1 employees are frauds. But maybe it is worse to be cowards, apathetic and uncivilized to ask for equal rights.

imh1b
11-01-2014, 10:21 PM
People against removing slavery in America often blamed African Americans. They often said that:
- "look at how blacks dress" - Not acknowledging that African Americans were poor and were not allowed to own property.
- "they have no education or look at how they talk" - Not acknowledging that African Americans were not immigrants and not allowed education.
- Or "look at how they behave or look or their moral are low"
And the list goes on.

No matter what you say, you cannot blame African Americans for slavery in America. Likewise, you cannot blame immigrants on H1/L1 for the slavery style system in America, a system protected and promoted by large technology companies (including the companies that many revere) and preserved by US Congress.

If immigrants are exploited by their employer and employer is not giving immigration paper work, will immigrants not take desperate measures to change and go to another employer? Is that wrong to take desperate measures to avoid exploitation? The current system is so heavily tilted in favor of the employer that if employer won't give you pay stubs, experience letters, H1 document, copies of green card petition - then it is so difficult to change employer. And 99.99% employers follow the practice that they will not give one or the other document to their immigrant employees.

Is it wrong for employees on H1/L1 to take desperate measures including padding resume, just so they can avoid the exploitation of their current employer? Even law allows to kill someone else in self defense, but some purist will make everyone on H1 and L1 believe that what we go through is somehow our fault or as Microsoft CEO Satya might like to call it "karma". This is bullshit.

It doesn't matter what is the degree, qualification or caliber of H1/L1 immigrant. What matters in any system is if the employee has the freedom to change employer.

Even someone with PhD will be subjected to exploitation in a corrupt system if:
1.) she/he is working in an system that makes it difficult for her/him to change employer and the system is heavily tilted in favor of the employer.
2.) employer wants to exploit their employee, and it could be because of any reason including - just because the law allows the employer to conduct itself in unethical manner.

There I take exception to your statement that:

Because it is not applicable in the current H1/L1 employee context.

Employees on H1/L1 are cowards, not frauds. They are suffering from apathy for the lives of their own children, but they are not frauds. They are not civilized enough for wanting to live free in a civilized society because they will not speak up, but not frauds. Unwilling to speak-up for their rights and unaware of the wrongs being caused to their families, but not frauds.

And the proof is, people on H1/L1 are unwilling to talk about this honest article. When oppressed or exploited people are unwilling to take on truth head-on, that is weakness, and no system can change with weakness.

If you talk 1-1 with people in desi parties, everyone will tell you their story of how they are being exploited by their employer, but not many people are willing to come forward to tell their real story.

So I take exception to your statement implying that H1/L1 employees are frauds. But maybe it is worse to be cowards, apathetic and uncivilized to ask for equal rights.

Very well said. 100% agree.

2008candid
11-03-2014, 11:41 AM
Looks like all backlogged countries H1Bs are excited about EO (me too). But I don't have high hope. Can we at least expect EAD filing upon 140 approval? IV is keeping silent on this.

snthampi
11-03-2014, 04:00 PM
People against removing slavery in America often blamed African Americans. They often said that:
- "look at how blacks dress" - Not acknowledging that African Americans were poor and were not allowed to own property.
- "they have no education or look at how they talk" - Not acknowledging that African Americans were not immigrants and not allowed education.
- Or "look at how they behave or look or their moral are low"
And the list goes on.

No matter what you say, you cannot blame African Americans for slavery in America. Likewise, you cannot blame immigrants on H1/L1 for the slavery style system in America, a system protected and promoted by large technology companies (including the companies that many revere) and preserved by US Congress.

If immigrants are exploited by their employer and employer is not giving immigration paper work, will immigrants not take desperate measures to change and go to another employer? Is that wrong to take desperate measures to avoid exploitation? The current system is so heavily tilted in favor of the employer that if employer won't give you pay stubs, experience letters, H1 document, copies of green card petition - then it is so difficult to change employer. And 99.99% employers follow the practice that they will not give one or the other document to their immigrant employees.

Is it wrong for employees on H1/L1 to take desperate measures including padding resume, just so they can avoid the exploitation of their current employer? Even law allows to kill someone else in self defense, but some purist will make everyone on H1 and L1 believe that what we go through is somehow our fault or as Microsoft CEO Satya might like to call it "karma". This is bullshit.

It doesn't matter what is the degree, qualification or caliber of H1/L1 immigrant. What matters in any system is if the employee has the freedom to change employer.

Even someone with PhD will be subjected to exploitation in a corrupt system if:
1.) she/he is working in an system that makes it difficult for her/him to change employer and the system is heavily tilted in favor of the employer.
2.) employer wants to exploit their employee, and it could be because of any reason including - just because the law allows the employer to conduct itself in unethical manner.

There I take exception to your statement that:

Because it is not applicable in the current H1/L1 employee context.

Employees on H1/L1 are cowards, not frauds. They are suffering from apathy for the lives of their own children, but they are not frauds. They are not civilized enough for wanting to live free in a civilized society because they will not speak up, but not frauds. Unwilling to speak-up for their rights and unaware of the wrongs being caused to their families, but not frauds.

And the proof is, people on H1/L1 are unwilling to talk about this honest article. When oppressed or exploited people are unwilling to take on truth head-on, that is weakness, and no system can change with weakness.

If you talk 1-1 with people in desi parties, everyone will tell you their story of how they are being exploited by their employer, but not many people are willing to come forward to tell their real story.

So I take exception to your statement implying that H1/L1 employees are frauds. But maybe it is worse to be cowards, apathetic and uncivilized to ask for equal rights.

You just downloaded a half page of crap with all false equivalences.

You can change jobs on H1. I have changed jobs on H1. Many of my friends have done it. If you have the skills, you can get a job anywhere in the US on H1 visa. So, your argument on that point is mute.

Did you even read everything I wrote? I never said all H1s/L1s are frauds. A person with required qualifications and skills for a H1 visa doesn't have to take up a job for 40-45k. If you do, you really don't have the skills and are getting into it by a false resume. Whether you agree or not, that is fraud.

Trying to justify fraud with personal situations is pathetic. Re-read my first post before downloading your crap again.

imh1b
11-03-2014, 05:37 PM
You just downloaded a half page of crap with all false equivalences.

You can change jobs on H1. I have changed jobs on H1. Many of my friends have done it. If you have the skills, you can get a job anywhere in the US on H1 visa. So, your argument on that point is mute.

Did you even read everything I wrote? I never said all H1s/L1s are frauds. A person with required qualifications and skills for a H1 visa doesn't have to take up a job for 40-45k. If you do, you really don't have the skills and are getting into it by a false resume. Whether you agree or not, that is fraud.

Trying to justify fraud with personal situations is pathetic. Re-read my first post before downloading your crap again.
If these H1Bs do not have skills and are not bright enough, how are they surviving in Microsoft, Apple, Cisco etc? Either the top companies in the world according to your logic are not good enough for your standards or there is some error in your logic.

abcdgc
11-03-2014, 08:44 PM
Looks like all backlogged countries H1Bs are excited about EO (me too). But I don't have high hope. Can we at least expect EAD filing upon 140 approval? IV is keeping silent on this.

What do you? A running commentary?

abcdgc
11-03-2014, 08:46 PM
Looks like all backlogged countries H1Bs are excited about EO (me too). But I don't have high hope. Can we at least expect EAD filing upon 140 approval? IV is keeping silent on this.

What do you want? A running commentary?

greyhair
11-03-2014, 09:20 PM
You just downloaded a half page of crap with all false equivalences.

You can change jobs on H1. I have changed jobs on H1. Many of my friends have done it. If you have the skills, you can get a job anywhere in the US on H1 visa. So, your argument on that point is mute.

Did you even read everything I wrote? I never said all H1s/L1s are frauds. A person with required qualifications and skills for a H1 visa doesn't have to take up a job for 40-45k. If you do, you really don't have the skills and are getting into it by a false resume. Whether you agree or not, that is fraud.

Trying to justify fraud with personal situations is pathetic. Re-read my first post before downloading your crap again.

Yes, it is possible for one can change jobs on H1, but it is fcuking so god damn difficult and risky that immigrants don't want to go through that. Just as it is possible to go to moon, but the risk and diminishing returns are not encouraging anyone to go there again. Why does it have to be so difficult for an immigrant to change employer? Why can't it be as difficult or easy as it is for US worker?

This means - the law is discouraging us to change jobs. If you fill up a room with 100 people on H1/L1, 99% will tell you that it is very difficult to change jobs. Rather, law doesn't even allow anyone on L1 visa to change employer. That 1% in the room who disagree with 99 others is some idiot arrogant foolish kid - that is you.

Wisdom demands to see the difficulty through the eyes and experiences of others. And foolishness is when (just like you) someone is thumping chest to somehow show that she/he is better than others. Your style of calling your own self as eligible/qualified for H1/L1 and all others who cannot change jobs as frauds is a sign of childish and immature outlook.

All fields or areas don't have same salary. I have known US citizens with PhD in non-IT fields making $34K, and so did PhDs on H1 visa.

So don't flash your credentials of having changed employer or making more than $45K to somehow imply that you are better than anyone else, because you are not. You or your W-2 is not the topic of debate.

And "False equivalence"? Is that a new phrase you just picked up? The issue here is the exploitation of immigrants, which is as real as the sun in the sky. If you haven't had a bad experience yet, then don't think that people who went through certain experiences are any less capable/smart/educated/professionals than you. Or somehow it was their fault. Your outlook gives an impression that you are fresh out of school immature kid who is always in competition with your surroundings and believes that if you haven't seen or experienced something then that something must not exist, or, it must be someone else fault. Which is why I don't have time to read your post.

There is clearly many faults in the system starting with employer having upper hand, immigration lawyers who are part of employer-lawyer nexus, large companies knowing subcontracting with exploiting desi employer, and giving campaign money (also referred to as bribes in other parts of the world) to members of congress. So don't throw this bullshit of blaming the victim.

snthampi
11-04-2014, 02:30 PM
Yes, it is possible for one can change jobs on H1, but it is fcuking so god damn difficult and risky that immigrants don't want to go through that. Just as it is possible to go to moon, but the risk and diminishing returns are not encouraging anyone to go there again. Why does it have to be so difficult for an immigrant to change employer? Why can't it be as difficult or easy as it is for US worker?

This means - the law is discouraging us to change jobs. If you fill up a room with 100 people on H1/L1, 99% will tell you that it is very difficult to change jobs. Rather, law doesn't even allow anyone on L1 visa to change employer. That 1% in the room who disagree with 99 others is some idiot arrogant foolish kid - that is you.

Wisdom demands to see the difficulty through the eyes and experiences of others. And foolishness is when (just like you) someone is thumping chest to somehow show that she/he is better than others. Your style of calling your own self as eligible/qualified for H1/L1 and all others who cannot change jobs as frauds is a sign of childish and immature outlook.

All fields or areas don't have same salary. I have known US citizens with PhD in non-IT fields making $34K, and so did PhDs on H1 visa.

So don't flash your credentials of having changed employer or making more than $45K to somehow imply that you are better than anyone else, because you are not. You or your W-2 is not the topic of debate.

And "False equivalence"? Is that a new phrase you just picked up? The issue here is the exploitation of immigrants, which is as real as the sun in the sky. If you haven't had a bad experience yet, then don't think that people who went through certain experiences are any less capable/smart/educated/professionals than you. Or somehow it was their fault. Your outlook gives an impression that you are fresh out of school immature kid who is always in competition with your surroundings and believes that if you haven't seen or experienced something then that something must not exist, or, it must be someone else fault. Which is why I don't have time to read your post.

There is clearly many faults in the system starting with employer having upper hand, immigration lawyers who are part of employer-lawyer nexus, large companies knowing subcontracting with exploiting desi employer, and giving campaign money (also referred to as bribes in other parts of the world) to members of congress. So don't throw this bullshit of blaming the victim.

Repeating the same BS again and again doesn't make it logical or meaningful. Your logic is horrible. You compared the plight of African slaves to immigrants. If you have any clue and sense, the African slaves were brought here in chains. Is that how you got here?

If you believe that you are treated like a slave or exploited, you have a choice: pack your bags and get the hell out.

Let me repeat this again, if you have real skills, changing jobs is jot difficult. It is funny that you conveniently leave out some of the fraud that I mentioned such as proxy interviews, bringing in friends and relatives who have no skills, paying co-workers to do the work. This is how people without skills get into companies like Microsoft, Google, etc. It is not a secret that immigrant groups especially Desis favoring their relatives, friends, people from their region, etc for jobs.

Again, if you think that the you are exploited by the US immigration system, it is not worth to stay back here. Pack up and go back.

Are there problems with the US immigration system? Of course there is and it will continue to have problems. Immigrating to another country is not like traveling to another state in your country. If you have minimum intelligence, you will be prepared for issues, hardships and delays. Stop whining and get a life.

gvenkat
11-04-2014, 04:27 PM
Repeating the same BS again and again doesn't make it logical or meaningful. Your logic is horrible. You compared the plight of African slaves to immigrants. If you have any clue and sense, the African slaves were brought here in chains. Is that how you got here?

If you believe that you are treated like a slave or exploited, you have a choice: pack your bags and get the hell out.

Let me repeat this again, if you have real skills, changing jobs is jot difficult. It is funny that you conveniently leave out some of the fraud that I mentioned such as proxy interviews, bringing in friends and relatives who have no skills, paying co-workers to do the work. This is how people without skills get into companies like Microsoft, Google, etc. It is not a secret that immigrant groups especially Desis favoring their relatives, friends, people from their region, etc for jobs.

Again, if you think that the you are exploited by the US immigration system, it is not worth to stay back here. Pack up and go back.

Are there problems with the US immigration system? Of course there is and it will continue to have problems. Immigrating to another country is not like traveling to another state in your country. If you have minimum intelligence, you will be prepared for issues, hardships and delays. Stop whining and get a life.

You can have all the friggin skills you want, you can't get in to jobs that specifically request GC or Citizenship. The point is your choice is rather narrowed and yes that is because the immigration system is broke. Everyone feels they are exploited because you have invested so much time, energy and money in this country that it feels frustrating. Easy for you to say pack and go back..

spicy_guy
11-05-2014, 10:21 AM
You can have all the friggin skills you want, you can't get in to jobs that specifically request GC or Citizenship. The point is your choice is rather narrowed and yes that is because the immigration system is broke. Everyone feels they are exploited because you have invested so much time, energy and money in this country that it feels frustrating. Easy for you to say pack and go back..

If our country has given us all the opportunities and other things that we enjoy here in US, we would not have come this far. Agree?

So we are here now. That means we feel this country is better than our home Country.
Obviously, this country has its share of problems and we are part of it. We can't change a thing in our own country (aside all the pep talk like "you should go out and try", blah, blah), why crying foul that Immigration system is broken in this country. Again, I am not saying its perfect. Yes, its broken in many ways.

At least, if we are united and put enough effort, we can change things here, but we are not ready to do. We want everything happen at our comfort of home/office and laptop.

Lets be honest. As IV always says, we are not putting enough effort towards our problems.

imh1b
11-05-2014, 11:10 AM
If our country has given us all the opportunities and other things that we enjoy here in US, we would not have come this far. Agree?

So we are here now. That means we feel this country is better than our home Country.
Obviously, this country has its share of problems and we are part of it. We can't change a thing in our own country (aside all the pep talk like "you should go out and try", blah, blah), why crying foul that Immigration system is broken in this country. Again, I am not saying its perfect. Yes, its broken in many ways.

At least, if we are united and put enough effort, we can change things here, but we are not ready to do. We want everything happen at our comfort of home/office and laptop.

Lets be honest. As IV always says, we are not putting enough effort towards our problems.

I agree with you.

The most we can say is 'Immigration system is broken' 'when is the H4 rule happening' 'what is the prediction for next month bulletin' 'let's track our case' etc

But since yesterday not a single person wanted to discuss yesterday's election results. We are so centered around 'MY GREENCARD' that we do not even care about the country we live in. And on top of it we want to live permanently in a country we do not care about.

As they say you reap what you sow. Legal immigrants have mostly turned a bling eye towards the issues facing USA. Their loyalties and concern is mostly for their birth country. Permanent residence is mostly to make more money by extending the job prospects and squeeze the maximum benefits of the great country USA. This is why you see fraud going on. Immigrants try hook or crook to come here in fraud colleges, do all kinds of fraud. Those who become greencard holders and citizens open business to squeeze more money from other immigrants. Its like ragging in colleges. In the first year as fresher everyone hates it. But from second year everyone wants it. The big companies know it all. But in a capitalist economy where profit is most important as long as it does not affect their bottom line, exploitation and fraud does not concern them.

It is a sad state. The saddest part is legal immigrants are not really slaves. They are educated, wealthy, smart and know their rights. But they are cowards, greedy and selfish. They will never stand up for themselves let alone for the entire legal community.

So the saga of 'broken immigration' will continue forever.

gvenkat
11-05-2014, 02:35 PM
I agree with you.

The most we can say is 'Immigration system is broken' 'when is the H4 rule happening' 'what is the prediction for next month bulletin' 'let's track our case' etc

But since yesterday not a single person wanted to discuss yesterday's election results. We are so centered around 'MY GREENCARD' that we do not even care about the country we live in. And on top of it we want to live permanently in a country we do not care about.

As they say you reap what you sow. Legal immigrants have mostly turned a bling eye towards the issues facing USA. Their loyalties and concern is mostly for their birth country. Permanent residence is mostly to make more money by extending the job prospects and squeeze the maximum benefits of the great country USA. This is why you see fraud going on. Immigrants try hook or crook to come here in fraud colleges, do all kinds of fraud. Those who become greencard holders and citizens open business to squeeze more money from other immigrants. Its like ragging in colleges. In the first year as fresher everyone hates it. But from second year everyone wants it. The big companies know it all. But in a capitalist economy where profit is most important as long as it does not affect their bottom line, exploitation and fraud does not concern them.

It is a sad state. The saddest part is legal immigrants are not really slaves. They are educated, wealthy, smart and know their rights. But they are cowards, greedy and selfish. They will never stand up for themselves let alone for the entire legal community.

So the saga of 'broken immigration' will continue forever.

How far did the advocacy take us? We have been advocating for how long? 6-7 years. What has drastically changed? Apart from two year EAD what changes have happened in the past?

The issue is Eb3-I is a miniscule minority that is getting screwed over. That is the fact. People have the right to be frustrated. Apart from the 10k eb3 people who have to endure this frustrating wait, Everyone else gets their GC within a 5-6 year period which is a fair time line. So don't blame the people who have every right to get frustrated.

snthampi
11-05-2014, 03:23 PM
You can have all the friggin skills you want, you can't get in to jobs that specifically request GC or Citizenship. The point is your choice is rather narrowed and yes that is because the immigration system is broke. Everyone feels they are exploited because you have invested so much time, energy and money in this country that it feels frustrating. Easy for you to say pack and go back..

First of all, if you thought immigrating to another country was going to be nice and easy, .... well, good luck.

There are plenty of jobs that don't require GC or citizenship. If you have the skills and qualifications, you can change jobs even in the 4th quarter. It will be obviously difficult for people with fake skill sets.

The US immigration system has problems, but is not broken. It is a repeated lie spread by the industry, mainly technology industry, to bring more immigrants, delay the immigration process and bring down the wages. That is one of the reasons why they don't care too much about quality. That is the reason why they don't care about the horrible practices of Indian consulting companies and the way they exploit immigrant workers. It is all about profits.

This country already permits a huge number of immigrants every year. If they let too many people in here, imagine what will happen to this country in another 20 years. Combine that with people that play favoritism on everything based on caste, region and religion. You would think people will learn to be fair and just at least when they move to another country. But that is not the case. Brought all the same corrupt practices along with them.

The most important think is having a good satisfying life. If your immigration status limits your and your loved ones' life and frustrates you, then it is not worth living in this country.

imh1b
11-05-2014, 03:58 PM
How far did the advocacy take us? We have been advocating for how long? 6-7 years. What has drastically changed? Apart from two year EAD what changes have happened in the past?



The answer to your question is in the question. That 'WE' is hardly 25-50 people who tried to go to Washington DC a couple of times in 6-7 years and only about the same number of people contributed a mere $25 or $50 for a few months in 6-7 years.

Moreover lets see how many of these 50 people even went to DC at least 4 times a year on a weekday? How many of these 50 ever went to a fund raising dinner with a congressman? Nobody. I can bet you on that. We would be foolish to expect anything out of this kind of effort.

Any intelligent person who knows advocacy will tell you that if with this microscopic tiny effort you could get a couple of small fixes, this is absolutely mega victory. You do not get anything with such tiny effort in advocacy. I think people have really no idea about advocacy. This advocacy is the real deal but almost all are not upto it and are cowards. Do As I said, we all reap what we sow. We have in reality got a bonanza till now for litttle we have done.

imh1b
11-05-2014, 04:09 PM
First of all, if you thought immigrating to another country was going to be nice and easy, .... well, good luck.

There are plenty of jobs that don't require GC or citizenship. If you have the skills and qualifications, you can change jobs even in the 4th quarter. It will be obviously difficult for people with fake skill sets.

The US immigration system has problems, but is not broken. It is a repeated lie spread by the industry, mainly technology industry, to bring more immigrants, delay the immigration process and bring down the wages. That is one of the reasons why they don't care too much about quality. That is the reason why they don't care about the horrible practices of Indian consulting companies and the way they exploit immigrant workers. It is all about profits.

This country already permits a huge number of immigrants every year. If they let too many people in here, imagine what will happen to this country in another 20 years. Combine that with people that play favoritism on everything based on caste, region and religion. You would think people will learn to be fair and just at least when they move to another country. But that is not the case. Brought all the same corrupt practices along with them.

The most important think is having a good satisfying life. If your immigration status limits your and your loved ones' life and frustrates you, then it is not worth living in this country.

I can bet $100 that you have a greencard and your views were different in 2006. It has changed over the years as you got EAD in 2007 and greencard later. You had a different view when you entered the country through consulting bodyshop by paying them, or entered by lying to the visa officer to get F1 visa. And then after college desperately trying to get an H1B sponsor one way or another. And when your spouse came to the country you tried hard to get her H1B through one way or another. Now after getting greencard, your views have changed. Its the same old story of almost every legal immigrant. So nothing new for me.

What matters to me as an IV member is that in the last 8 years since you joined IV how much have you contributed, how many times have you gone to Washington DC. Any IV core member can check for me because I have gone at least once a year and for several years I have $25 contribution per month on. How many times have to spoken to press? How many employers have you reported? Have you ever filed a case against a bad employer yet? What about you?

Its easy to say lot of things but have you tried to change anything so far other than expressing arrogance in your posts that is a disease of many so called best and the brightest cowards sitting in their tiny cubicles.

chakdepatte
11-05-2014, 04:45 PM
if everyone is done with their 2 cents. can we regroup to work with a congress that supports Legal immigration.

No more B.S. from Democrats to support illegal anymore!!!

whiteStallion
11-05-2014, 05:15 PM
Now that the Republicans have majority in House and Senate, how does it impact EO, or does it impact at all ? The reason for which BO "delayed" the EO till after the election anyway did not work out for the Democrats, most folks are anti-Obama these days, even part of the Democratic party.

snthampi
11-06-2014, 04:17 PM
I can bet $100 that you have a greencard and your views were different in 2006. It has changed over the years as you got EAD in 2007 and greencard later. You had a different view when you entered the country through consulting bodyshop by paying them, or entered by lying to the visa officer to get F1 visa. And then after college desperately trying to get an H1B sponsor one way or another. And when your spouse came to the country you tried hard to get her H1B through one way or another. Now after getting greencard, your views have changed. Its the same old story of almost every legal immigrant. So nothing new for me.

What matters to me as an IV member is that in the last 8 years since you joined IV how much have you contributed, how many times have you gone to Washington DC. Any IV core member can check for me because I have gone at least once a year and for several years I have $25 contribution per month on. How many times have to spoken to press? How many employers have you reported? Have you ever filed a case against a bad employer yet? What about you?

Its easy to say lot of things but have you tried to change anything so far other than expressing arrogance in your posts that is a disease of many so called best and the brightest cowards sitting in their tiny cubicles.

You are a real idiot, because you are making wild assumptions and spewing out BS on that basis. You are assuming that everyone else's story is just as yours, as you narrated above. Unlike you, I didn't have to pay anyone or lie to get a H1, because I had the qualification, sufficient experience and the skills required for getting a H1 Visa. I have nothing to prove to you. Still, for the sake of this conversation, I will tell you that I am still on H1 because my spouse is still on H4. I do have EAD that I never used so far and never attempted to get a H1 for my spouse.

Folks like you repeat the same BS again and again like a broken record without any substance. It is not helping. Stop whining and stop blaming America for your problems. America is not doing any injustice to you. You knew very well what you were getting into when you decide to immigrate to the US. Face it or get the hell out.

I have contributed to IV financially but never attended any advocacy event. I am not the one who is complaining or questioning IV's efforts. I HAVE NO COMPLAINTS. Now, you may ask what am I doing in this forum. Well, the reason is that people like you are very entertaining with your constant BS. It is good comical relief.

Don't take it too personal and stress affect your health. Have fun.

abcdgc
11-07-2014, 09:36 AM
You are a real idiot, because you are making wild assumptions and spewing out BS on that basis. You are assuming that everyone else's story is just as yours, as you narrated above. Unlike you, I didn't have to pay anyone or lie to get a H1, because I had the qualification, sufficient experience and the skills required for getting a H1 Visa. I have nothing to prove to you. Still, for the sake of this conversation, I will tell you that I am still on H1 because my spouse is still on H4. I do have EAD that I never used so far and never attempted to get a H1 for my spouse.

Folks like you repeat the same BS again and again like a broken record without any substance. It is not helping. Stop whining and stop blaming America for your problems. America is not doing any injustice to you. You knew very well what you were getting into when you decide to immigrate to the US. Face it or get the hell out.

I have contributed to IV financially but never attended any advocacy event. I am not the one who is complaining or questioning IV's efforts. I HAVE NO COMPLAINTS. Now, you may ask what am I doing in this forum. Well, the reason is that people like you are very entertaining with your constant BS. It is good comical relief.

Don't take it too personal and stress affect your health. Have fun.


You are qualified and skilled. Others are faking and padding resume. You did not pay for H1 and all others are frauds? Nice

Let me google that for you (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=snthampi)

Is this you?
https://twitter.com/snthampi

And this?
Nagendran Thampi | LinkedIn (http://www.linkedin.com/in/nagendranthampi)

So reaching the position of "Programmer Analyst" after 15 years explain why you feel that you qualified - for your current job. And you think there are not enough Americans available to do Programmer Analyst job?

And according to your Linkedin profile you seem to have came to US though InSyst Inc . Is this IT placement company? And you want everyone to believe that you did not pay for your H1 but all other are frauds?

I am simply asking questions because you are one making allegations. Can you answer these questions?

imh1b
11-07-2014, 11:54 AM
You are qualified and skilled. Others are faking and padding resume. You did not pay for H1 and all others are frauds? Nice

Let me google that for you (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=snthampi)

Is this you?
https://twitter.com/snthampi

And this?
Nagendran Thampi | LinkedIn (http://www.linkedin.com/in/nagendranthampi)

So reaching the position of "Programmer Analyst" after 15 years explain why you feel that you qualified - for your current job. And you think there are not enough Americans available to do Programmer Analyst job?

And according to your Linkedin profile you seem to have came to US though InSyst Inc . Is this IT placement company? And you want everyone to believe that you did not pay for your H1 but all other are frauds?

I am simply asking questions because you are one making allegations. Can you answer these questions?

That is so funny. I am rolling on the floor laughing out loud!
You have exposed this idiot paper tiger.

snthampi
11-07-2014, 12:07 PM
That is so funny. I am rolling on the floor laughing out loud!
You have exposed this idiot paper tiger.

It is of course funny, because you are looking at my 2001 job title and making assumptions. LOL!

snthampi
11-07-2014, 12:13 PM
You are qualified and skilled. Others are faking and padding resume. You did not pay for H1 and all others are frauds? Nice

Let me google that for you (http://lmgtfy.com/?q=snthampi)

Is this you?
https://twitter.com/snthampi

And this?
Nagendran Thampi | LinkedIn (http://www.linkedin.com/in/nagendranthampi)

So reaching the position of "Programmer Analyst" after 15 years explain why you feel that you qualified - for your current job. And you think there are not enough Americans available to do Programmer Analyst job?

And according to your Linkedin profile you seem to have came to US though InSyst Inc . Is this IT placement company? And you want everyone to believe that you did not pay for your H1 but all other are frauds?

I am simply asking questions because you are one making allegations. Can you answer these questions?

You are really !!!HIGH SKILLED!!! immigrant because you are looking at someone's 13+ years old resume and commenting on that. It is fair that people like you are waiting for 10 plus years for your GC.

"You did not pay for H1 and all others are frauds?" I didn't make that statement. Another idiot made that assumption. You have difficulty reading and understanding what people post. Follow a conversation before commenting.

abcdgc
11-07-2014, 09:18 PM
It is of course funny, because you are looking at my 2001 job title and making assumptions. LOL!

snthampi aka Nagendran Thampi aka "Only non-fraud High skilled",

Either you are this person with the job title in 2001, or, you are not this person. Make up your mind. Can't decide, you are High Skilled and others are all frauds, remember? So you it should not take you long to decide. Why is it taking so much time?

Why are you having your job title from 2001 in your linkedin profile? If you have updated other parts of your linkedin profile with latest employer info etc then why would you not change your title? Maybe because your high skilled green card application is not so high skilled because it is filed with job title - Programmer Analyst? And even though that is the job title in your labor certification, you are no longer working with that job title? Is that what you are trying to say? Well, in that case are you not defrauding the system by pretending someone you are not.

You are either Programmer Analyst and not high skilled and thus defrauding the system. Or, you are pretending to be Programmer Analyst and defrauding the system on your green card petition? Which one is it?

Oh, all others in the system are still frauds, isn't it?

sachuin23
11-12-2014, 08:46 PM
Hi Team

Found this Source: Obama to announce 10-point immigration plan via exec action as early as next week | Fox News (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/11/12/source-obama-to-announce-10-point-immigration-plan-via-exec-action-as-early-as/) online.

Was hoping to get some feedback from IV if it has something for high skilled immigrants.This article talks about some Tech visa through a government Agency which can provide around 500K tech visas. Not sure, if this is something that can help us.

Looking forward to reply from our senior members.

prince_nagi@yahoo.com
11-13-2014, 01:40 AM
Hi Team

Found this Source: Obama to announce 10-point immigration plan via exec action as early as next week | Fox News (http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/11/12/source-obama-to-announce-10-point-immigration-plan-via-exec-action-as-early-as/) online.

Was hoping to get some feedback from IV if it has something for high skilled immigrants.This article talks about some Tech visa through a government Agency which can provide around 500K tech visas. Not sure, if this is something that can help us.

Looking forward to reply from our senior members.

Guys any inputs on this , if this has any positive impact on backlog.

prince_nagi@yahoo.com
11-13-2014, 01:53 AM
Guys any inputs on this , if this has any positive impact on backlog.


I was in the impression that with exec order president cannot increase h1 limit , but as per the news , Obama is passing order for half million visas .

Admin / sr members - your thoughts.

Also if undocumented can get ead , why not we be given a long term ead - it will reduce the pain of h1 folks.

pappu
11-13-2014, 07:34 AM
I was in the impression that with exec order president cannot increase h1 limit , but as per the news , Obama is passing order for half million visas .

Admin / sr members - your thoughts.

Also if undocumented can get ead , why not we be given a long term ead - it will reduce the pain of h1 folks.

While there is expectation that there maybe something for us based on our Immigration voice-Administration meetings and positive reaction to our proposed changes, at the end of the day whoever advocates the most gets it.

Undocumented have been advocating a lot for many years. They have invested millions in it. For legals it has been companies who have advocated and have invested millions. So if we want interests of legal immigrants not be overlooked we should be speaking up more, travel more often in large numbers to DC, have recurring contribution every month. This is the only way IV can put in more resources at work, do more frequent meetings so that the issue is not buried. Legal immigrants who have received greencards or have become citizens also need to continue the association and play a larger role in terms of campaign contributions to lawmakers, having a PAC, investing in policy research and basically formalizing this effort on a much larger scale. This issue needs to tackled beyond forums, selfish interests, calculations and tracking discussions, and petty differences. I do not see any other way that we can get everything we want on forums be given to us.

columbusdude007
11-13-2014, 12:51 PM
Check this out:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/11/14/us/obama-immigration.html?hp&action=click&pgtype=Homepage&module=first-column-region&region=top-news&WT.nav=top-news&_r=1

greyhair
11-13-2014, 11:53 PM
How far did the advocacy take us? We have been advocating for how long? 6-7 years. What has drastically changed? Apart from two year EAD what changes have happened in the past?

The issue is Eb3-I is a miniscule minority that is getting screwed over. That is the fact. People have the right to be frustrated. Apart from the 10k eb3 people who have to endure this frustrating wait, Everyone else gets their GC within a 5-6 year period which is a fair time line. So don't blame the people who have every right to get frustrated.


What are you talking about? The entire backlog is EB3-I. It is not a "miniscule minority". Eb3-I is a huge majority. The majority of cowards and wussies. Yes people have right to be frustrated. But people who don't do anything about their problems, will surely be frustrated. Congratulations that you deserve that right. Oh, let me take that back because Eb3-I don't deserve that right. Because if you were truely frustrated, you would be writing letters, doing meetings with lawmakers, collaborating with others wanting to make policy change and shouting on top of the roof to change your situation. Have you done any of this? No. That means you are not frustrated yet. You only pretend that you are frustrated. But you wussies have no guts and no backbone to do anything for yourself. Look at your pathetic self, you think that posting on some internet forum anonymously you are expressing frustration? I'm Eb-2 and I sound more frustrated or hungry to get greencard. On the contrary you sound like a phony, pretending to be frustrated. Which is why you have not done anything to improve your condition. Now don't show your childish behavior telling me to have pitty on you because you are Eb-3 and I am Eb-2. I've traveled to Washington 4 times for 3 days on each trip to speak with lawmakers about backlogs. And most of the time I spoke about solutions for Eb-3 backlogs. What have you done for yourself and Eb-3? Please tell me why others should not blame you for your problems? More importantly, get your facts straight. Eb3-I backlog is a lot more than 10k. Which also explains why you are in this shithole - because if you don't even care to measure the depth of the shithole you are in, then how can you come out of it.

It is not your fault that you don't understand the meaning of advocacy. Advocacy is not an IT project that there is an allocated time & budget, and at the end of budget, on due date you have expected outcome. Politics doesn't work like that which is why advocacy doesn't work like that. Advocacy is generally multi year process which takes time to change the hearts and minds of policy makers, then you have to wait for the opportune time and political climate, find your champion to push for your bill and then neutralize all opponents so majority will vote for your position. This is just a small summary because it is lot more complex than that. When I was traveling to DC for one of the IV advocacy event, during the training session, IV lobbyist suggested that we read the book - the art of war by Sun Tzu. I came back home and many months later, last year I found time to read this book. It was an eye opener. You should consider reading it if you have time.

There is only one way to fix Eb3-I. Advocacy. What else is the alternative? tracking your dates? Best of luck.

Nothing personal and no hard feelings.

Respectfully and In peace,

spicy_guy
11-14-2014, 10:54 AM
The immigration waiting game will end soon - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/14/politics/obama-immigration/)

AceMan
11-14-2014, 11:47 AM
The immigration waiting game will end soon - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2014/11/14/politics/obama-immigration/)

Same day Pigs will fly. This President has been all great talks.. and well very little substance with immigration.

blizkreeg
11-14-2014, 02:44 PM
What are you talking about? The entire backlog is EB3-I. It is not a "miniscule minority". Eb3-I is a huge majority. The majority of cowards and wussies. Yes people have right to be frustrated. But people who don't do anything about their problems, will surely be frustrated. Congratulations that you deserve that right. Oh, let me take that back because Eb3-I don't deserve that right. Because if you were truely frustrated, you would be writing letters, doing meetings with lawmakers, collaborating with others wanting to make policy change and shouting on top of the roof to change your situation. Have you done any of this? No. That means you are not frustrated yet. You only pretend that you are frustrated. But you wussies have no guts and no backbone to do anything for yourself. Look at your pathetic self, you think that posting on some internet forum anonymously you are expressing frustration? I'm Eb-2 and I sound more frustrated or hungry to get greencard. On the contrary you sound like a phony, pretending to be frustrated. Which is why you have not done anything to improve your condition. Now don't show your childish behavior telling me to have pitty on you because you are Eb-3 and I am Eb-2. I've traveled to Washington 4 times for 3 days on each trip to speak with lawmakers about backlogs. And most of the time I spoke about solutions for Eb-3 backlogs. What have you done for yourself and Eb-3? Please tell me why others should not blame you for your problems? More importantly, get your facts straight. Eb3-I backlog is a lot more than 10k. Which also explains why you are in this shithole - because if you don't even care to measure the depth of the shithole you are in, then how can you come out of it.

It is not your fault that you don't understand the meaning of advocacy. Advocacy is not an IT project that there is an allocated time & budget, and at the end of budget, on due date you have expected outcome. Politics doesn't work like that which is why advocacy doesn't work like that. Advocacy is generally multi year process which takes time to change the hearts and minds of policy makers, then you have to wait for the opportune time and political climate, find your champion to push for your bill and then neutralize all opponents so majority will vote for your position. This is just a small summary because it is lot more complex than that. When I was traveling to DC for one of the IV advocacy event, during the training session, IV lobbyist suggested that we read the book - the art of war by Sun Tzu. I came back home and many months later, last year I found time to read this book. It was an eye opener. You should consider reading it if you have time.

There is only one way to fix Eb3-I. Advocacy. What else is the alternative? tracking your dates? Best of luck.

Nothing personal and no hard feelings.

Respectfully and In peace,
greyhair: just wow at the hate you spewed in your post and lumping everyone in that category into one bucket. I especially loved your closing: "Nothing personal and no hard feelings. Respectfully and In peace". Classy.

greyhair
11-14-2014, 08:45 PM
greyhair: just wow at the hate you spewed in your post and lumping everyone in that category into one bucket. I especially loved your closing: "Nothing personal and no hard feelings. Respectfully and In peace". Classy.

I did not lump anyone in any category. You read my post and your guilt of not doing enough/anything is creating your perception that I'm lumping you. I merely tried to describe your behavior of apathy towards yourself . But according to you, my description of your behavior is hate, but your behavior is one of a sage. That's just great.

You seem to be the one who is guilty conscious. And that is my fault? Good God!

blizkreeg
11-15-2014, 01:04 PM
I did not lump anyone in any category. You read my post and your guilt of not doing enough/anything is creating your perception that I'm lumping you. I merely tried to describe your behavior of apathy towards yourself . But according to you, my description of your behavior is hate, but your behavior is one of a sage. That's just great.

You seem to be the one who is guilty conscious. And that is my fault? Good God!
calm down, tiger.

gten
11-18-2014, 08:22 PM
While there is expectation that there maybe something for us based on our Immigration voice-Administration meetings and positive reaction to our proposed changes, at the end of the day whoever advocates the most gets it.

Undocumented have been advocating a lot for many years. They have invested millions in it. For legals it has been companies who have advocated and have invested millions. So if we want interests of legal immigrants not be overlooked we should be speaking up more, travel more often in large numbers to DC, have recurring contribution every month. This is the only way IV can put in more resources at work, do more frequent meetings so that the issue is not buried. Legal immigrants who have received greencards or have become citizens also need to continue the association and play a larger role in terms of campaign contributions to lawmakers, having a PAC, investing in policy research and basically formalizing this effort on a much larger scale. This issue needs to tackled beyond forums, selfish interests, calculations and tracking discussions, and petty differences. I do not see any other way that we can get everything we want on forums be given to us.

Thank you for all your efforts. It's been awfully quiet here, especially when immigration admin fixes is in the news everyday.

dkshitij
11-18-2014, 09:10 PM
Obama Immigration Orders Said to Include Parents of Citizens - Bloomberg (http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-11-18/obama-immigration-orders-said-to-include-parents-of-citizens.html)

This bloomberg article mentions OPT relief for legals. No other relief for legals is mentioned. It conjectures order to be issued on Thursday.

Administrator2
11-19-2014, 09:15 AM
Thank you for all your efforts. It's been awfully quiet here, especially when immigration admin fixes is in the news everyday.

As you may have noticed, we have been evolving and moving away from forum style back-and-forth because it is not productive for Advocacy efforts. In our experience, forum style is be good for personal immigration application issue discussion, but not for Advocacy.

Things are quiet on the forum not because things are not being worked behind the scene. Things are quiet on the forum because we prefer it that way over people ranting anonymously without productively participating. Hope this helps.

In case you are interested, here is a newsletter that was sent out today:

Update on Administrative Fixes (http://app.getresponse.com/archive/ivnewsletter/Update-on-Administrative-Fixes-113789105.html?e=&u=BYcd)

pak
11-19-2014, 10:17 AM
Immigration Voice Newsletter: 11/19/2014


November 19, 2014 at 7:59am (https://www.facebook.com/notes/immigration-voice/immigration-voice-newsletter-11192014/817557368310489)
Dear Friends,

As many of you may have heard, President Obama’s administration is planning to announce immigration relief in the form of administrative reform in the next few days. While the exact details are unknown at this time, there are some specific reforms that we have requested (http://goo.gl/Cfg70C) the White House and the Department of Homeland Security’s policy makers for the skilled immigration system. We expect that many of these reforms are likely to be included in the package that is announced. This announcement may come as early as this week.

In addition to recapture of unused green cards and EAD for H-4 visa holders, Immigration Voice has pushed for many different quality of life fixes to the system. We expect that a combination of the following fixes, in some variation, will be announced very soon by the administration.


Allow applicant to submit and DHS to receive Adjustment of Status application when a visa number is not available.
Providing clarity to current law by clearly defining "Same or Similar Occupation Classification".
Providing the immigration case related paperwork to the beneficiary by USCIS and Department of Labor. Currently, immigrants do not have access to their own immigration paper work making them beholden to the employers, skewing the labor market.
Improving the system so that immigrants are not required to re-file and start employment based visa process all over again every time they change employer. This aspect of the system is being excessively abused by bad employers in marketplace to coerce and threaten immigrant employees from changing jobs, resulting in employee exploitation and preventing labor mobility.
Allow porting of Priority Date between primary applicant's Employment Based green card petition and Spouse's Employment Based green card petition.
Making Visa Bulletin 'Current' allowing applicants to adjust status.
Providing clarity for allowing immigrants to start companies and work for their own companies on Optional Practical Training (OPT), Employment Authorization Document (EAD) pending Adjustment of Status and H1-B visas, without impractical restrictions that are not required by the existing law.
Grant automatic extensions for 240 days of Work Authorization and Advance Parole if extension was filed prior to expiry of Work Authorization or Advance Parole.

We know that when we are restricted from freely moving in the market between employers and positions due to green card delays, it limits our potential to grow. It also binds us to our sponsoring employers and makes us more attractive as employees in hi-tech industry where employee turnover is high and employee retention is tough. Because of the unfair competition created by long green card backlogs, a US citizen cannot compete on a level playing field against an immigrant who is bonded to his or her employer. Freeing people to move between employers and positions helps us grow; level the playing field for US citizens for fair competition and is beneficial to overall economy. The same rationale applies to the less skills labor market largely filled in by the undocumented immigrants.

It is extremely important for us as a community of skilled immigrants to stand shoulder to shoulder alongside our brothers and sisters who are undocumented but have contributed to the economy of their adopted homeland, just like we have. It is very easy to get mired in the bristling politics of the issue, but we must keep in mind that the relief announced for the undocumented is long overdue and well deserved just like the relief that is announced for us. We have to stand in support of the administrative reform package when we talk to friends, colleagues, social media, press, public forums and policy makers – and speak with one voice. Making incendiary comments is not only wrong from moral perspective, it is also bad politics.

Although it is very easy to preach the virtue of the lawfulness, we have to remember that most of us, directly or indirectly, benefit from undocumented immigration. The very agitators, who might want to deport everyone, are the ones who live in houses that are built by undocumented immigrants; buy produce picked by undocumented immigrants and stay in hotel rooms maintained by the very undocumented immigrants they want to deport. They all reap benefits of cheap, exploited and helpless undocumented immigrants and yet refuse to let them be a part our society, just as skilled workers. We have to be careful and not get carried away by the tsunami of this hypocritical rant that is expected to follow the administrative reform.

As always, we will do our best to keep you informed as we hear more from policy makers and we thank you for your support and dedication to your noble cause.

Stay connected to know more and don't forget to contribute (http://donations.immigrationvoice.org (http://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fdonations.immigrationvoice.or g%2F&h=iAQEjH6lL&s=1))!

Aman Kapoor
Immigration Voice
www.ImmigrationVoice.org (http://www.ImmigrationVoice.org/)

shining
11-19-2014, 11:20 AM
Obama to announce immigration order in Las Vegas on Friday (http://www.cnbc.com/id/102183389)


Cheers
Shining

shining
11-19-2014, 11:23 AM
Obama to announce immigration order in Las Vegas on Friday (http://www.cnbc.com/id/102183389)




“We hear there will be a prime time Thursday evening announcement (to preview) and full unveiling in Vegas on Friday,” AFL-CIO spokesman Jeff Hauser wrote in an e-mail, which was inadvertently sent to a group of reporters Wednesday morning. “Can folks begin to work and plan watch parties for Thursday and/or Friday? Unclear whether Thursday night content will be what is "celebratory", but Friday will be where we need a lot of energy guaranteed.”

Cheers Shining

whiteStallion
11-19-2014, 12:20 PM
Thanks Aman and the entire IV organization for all the backchannel work. Almost counting down hours now to Friday..

bikram_das_in
11-19-2014, 12:55 PM
Obama to address immigration Thursday night (http://www.cnbc.com/id/102183389)

How long does it take for executive order to take effect once it is signed?

Administrator2
11-19-2014, 02:26 PM
Obama to address immigration Thursday night (http://www.cnbc.com/id/102183389)

How long does it take for executive order to take effect once it is signed?

One step at time. Lets first digest this historic event. This is most significant immigration related event for over a decade.

sanjay
11-19-2014, 02:28 PM
Immigration Voice Newsletter: 11/19/2014


November 19, 2014 at 7:59am (https://www.facebook.com/notes/immigration-voice/immigration-voice-newsletter-11192014/817557368310489)
Dear Friends,

As many of you may have heard, President Obama’s administration is planning to announce immigration relief in the form of administrative reform in the next few days. While the exact details are unknown at this time, there are some specific reforms that we have requested (http://goo.gl/Cfg70C) the White House and the Department of Homeland Security’s policy makers for the skilled immigration system. We expect that many of these reforms are likely to be included in the package that is announced. This announcement may come as early as this week.

In addition to recapture of unused green cards and EAD for H-4 visa holders, Immigration Voice has pushed for many different quality of life fixes to the system. We expect that a combination of the following fixes, in some variation, will be announced very soon by the administration.

www.ImmigrationVoice.org (http://www.ImmigrationVoice.org/)


With all the above 8 points I am still unable to get how the process is going to reduce time for people who are already been waiting from 2003? I think I am missing something here. Can some one explain? I could allow people who missed 2007 train to be on board again, but that would just give EAD and nothing much. It's been 7 years and extending EAD after EAD every time. I see no end to the process.

shining
11-19-2014, 02:48 PM
With all the above 8 points I am still unable to get how the process is going to reduce time for people who are already been waiting from 2003? I think I am missing something here. Can some one explain? I could allow people who missed 2007 train to be on board again, but that would just give EAD and nothing much. It's been 7 years and extending EAD after EAD every time. I see no end to the process.


Bulletin will become current for most -hopefully all

spulugur
11-19-2014, 02:52 PM
(5) using's Spouse's priority date also helps with chipping away at the backlog.

sanjay
11-19-2014, 03:10 PM
Bulletin will become current for most -hopefully all

That's what I was asking. If visa bulletin becomes current, how is it going to reduce the current back log? Had this Visa bulletin did not become current in July, 07?

What is there in EO to reduce the current backlog?

shining
11-19-2014, 03:39 PM
That's what I was asking. If visa bulletin becomes current, how is it going to reduce the current back log? Had this Visa bulletin did not become current in July, 07?

What is there in EO to reduce the current backlog?

July 07 was a fiasco and an error--now, that unused visas are made available and if dependents are not counted it increases the number makes the numbers current and clears the backlog-

dpuranik
11-19-2014, 04:00 PM
With all the above 8 points I am still unable to get how the process is going to reduce time for people who are already been waiting from 2003? I think I am missing something here. Can some one explain? I could allow people who missed 2007 train to be on board again, but that would just give EAD and nothing much. It's been 7 years and extending EAD after EAD every time. I see no end to the process.

People waiting from 2003 have to wait few more years even their date is current, because USCIS have to process 5 million+ EAD & AP now.

pd052011
11-19-2014, 06:04 PM
People waiting from 2003 have to wait few more years even their date is current, because USCIS have to process 5 million+ EAD & AP now.

True. It seems like I am one of the cynics. I do not think the EO will have any provisions for legals. Maybe just the H4 work permit and increased H1s but thats it.

I sure would like to be pleasantly surprised tomorrow.

Administrator2
11-19-2014, 06:35 PM
With all the above 8 points I am still unable to get how the process is going to reduce time for people who are already been waiting from 2003? I think I am missing something here. Can some one explain? I could allow people who missed 2007 train to be on board again, but that would just give EAD and nothing much. It's been 7 years and extending EAD after EAD every time. I see no end to the process.


If you are asking about EO adding more green cards, then the answer is - very unlikely. Green cards cannot be added by EO, it will need act of Congress. But that doesn't mean that anything less than adding more green cards is not welcome. We expect that EO will have fixes that will make it easier to change employer, or, maybe start your business, or, do the things that one would otherwise be able to do after getting green card. Is that not be a welcome change? Nowhere in the law says that employees can change employer with as much ease before getting green card, but we believe that EO will enable immigrants their life with more freedom. Which is why EO is most significant change since over a decade.

Overall the key is - will it help large number of immigrants - Yes. Will EO give everyone green card quickly - No. Will everybody benefit from EO - yes, in some way, a lot of immigrants directly and some indirectly. You have been renewing EAD for 7 years, would it not help to get clarity that will allow you to change employer and live with more security? That is less than getting a green card but is it not better than where you are today?

We all agree that EO is not going to be the end of it. We will still need Congress to add more green cards and remove per-country limits, which is why we need everyone to NOT sit back after benefiting from EO.

If anyone here thinks that these possible changes doesn’t affect you, then that’s fine. Let work with Congress to pass a bill for more green cards and remove per country limits. But we believe that a lot of skilled immigrants will benefit from these changes.

Hope this clarifies.

legalimmi11
11-19-2014, 08:05 PM
Thank you so much IV for your leadership and putting points across to Administration for high skilled immigrants. Let's hope that we will see these changes in tomorrow's announcement.

rbusgc
11-19-2014, 08:16 PM
If you are asking about EO adding more green cards, then the answer is - very unlikely. Green cards cannot be added by EO, it will need act of Congress. But that doesn't mean that anything less than adding more green cards is not welcome. We expect that EO will have fixes that will make it easier to change employer, or, maybe start your business, or, do the things that one would otherwise be able to do after getting green card. Is that not be a welcome change? Nowhere in the law says that employees can change employer with as much ease before getting green card, but we believe that EO will enable immigrants their life with more freedom. Which is why EO is most significant change since over a decade.

Overall the key is - will it help large number of immigrants - Yes. Will EO give everyone green card quickly - No. Will everybody benefit from EO - yes, in some way, a lot of immigrants directly and some indirectly. You have been renewing EAD for 7 years, would it not help to get clarity that will allow you to change employer and live with more security? That is less than getting a green card but is it not better than where you are today?

We all agree that EO is not going to be the end of it. We will still need Congress to add more green cards and remove per-country limits, which is why we need everyone to NOT sit back after benefiting from EO.

If anyone here thinks that these possible changes doesn’t affect you, then that’s fine. Let work with Congress to pass a bill for more green cards and remove per country limits. But we believe that a lot of skilled immigrants will benefit from these changes.

Hope this clarifies.

Doesn't the visa/GC recapture mentioned as part of EO practically remove the backlogs? ... not sure why you mentioned that EO won't add any GCs...:confused:

shyamps
11-19-2014, 08:23 PM
If you are asking about EO adding more green cards, then the answer is - very unlikely. Green cards cannot be added by EO, it will need act of Congress. But that doesn't mean that anything less than adding more green cards is not welcome. We expect that EO will have fixes that will make it easier to change employer, or, maybe start your business, or, do the things that one would otherwise be able to do after getting green card. Is that not be a welcome change? Nowhere in the law says that employees can change employer with as much ease before getting green card, but we believe that EO will enable immigrants their life with more freedom. Which is why EO is most significant change since over a decade.

Overall the key is - will it help large number of immigrants - Yes. Will EO give everyone green card quickly - No. Will everybody benefit from EO - yes, in some way, a lot of immigrants directly and some indirectly. You have been renewing EAD for 7 years, would it not help to get clarity that will allow you to change employer and live with more security? That is less than getting a green card but is it not better than where you are today?

We all agree that EO is not going to be the end of it. We will still need Congress to add more green cards and remove per-country limits, which is why we need everyone to NOT sit back after benefiting from EO.

If anyone here thinks that these possible changes doesn’t affect you, then that’s fine. Let work with Congress to pass a bill for more green cards and remove per country limits. But we believe that a lot of skilled immigrants will benefit from these changes.

Hope this clarifies.

Thank you soo much IV, Aman and team for all the hard work. I want to join you all in this fight. Are you all planning any advocacy event in Washington DC anytime soon?

2008candid
11-19-2014, 08:28 PM
Now I believe that something is going to happen for legal. I was little skeptical because there was no update from IV till now.

Thank you for your effort

GCkiyaGanja
11-19-2014, 09:22 PM
Sir , do you feel that this could potentially create another backlog for EAD and AP extensions ? please share your opinion

shining
11-19-2014, 09:36 PM
Doesn't the visa/GC recapture mentioned as part of EO practically remove the backlogs? ... not sure why you mentioned that EO won't add any GCs...:confused:


SO what he is saying there will be no new green cards added i.e. during a year the number remains 140K.

However, the EO should fix the backlog situation as it will infuse unused numbers from prior years and removal of dependents. This should make all numbers current and folks whose 485s are pending can get their much awaited GCs

Cheers
Shining

columbusdude007
11-19-2014, 09:52 PM
True. It seems like I am one of the cynics. I do not think the EO will have any provisions for legals. Maybe just the H4 work permit and increased H1s but thats it.

I sure would like to be pleasantly surprised tomorrow.
Don't get disheartened by IV 8 Point Agenda, POTUS is using it as toilet paper. He is going to listen to DHS Secretary and other USCIS officials who know what they are talking about. From what the below report says, you and I will get benefited when the POTUS announces his EA tomorrow evening!

Obama to shield 5 million from deportation - POLITICO (http://www.politico.com/story/2014/11/obama-immigration-plan-unveil-113022.html#ixzz3JYOpwAJB)

Administrator2
11-19-2014, 10:52 PM
Don't get disheartened by IV 8 Point Agenda, POTUS is using it as toilet paper. He is going to listen to DHS Secretary and other USCIS officials who know what they are talking about. From what the below report says, you and I will get benefited when the POTUS announces his EA tomorrow evening!

Obama to shield 5 million from deportation - POLITICO (http://www.politico.com/story/2014/11/obama-immigration-plan-unveil-113022.html#ixzz3JYOpwAJB)


We would be very happy, rather astounded if the President decides to do recapture and/or dependents exemption. This is one of those things where we would welcome to be wrong in our assessment. We have also separately asked and advocated for recapture and dependents exemptions but the truth is that the chances are very less for recapture and/or dependents recapture, and we are only helping you manage your expectations ahead of the announcement.

Now that is out of the way, let me mention this. It is because of immature folks who cannot have a civil discussion that it is difficult to share what we know. As soon as we share something real, there is always one to those idiot hiding somewhere who immediately pop-up its head just because he doesn't like the message. And then this group of mostly handful of immature folks start with attacking the messenger as if immediately the other person is the mortal enemy. Grow up please.

aj2000
11-19-2014, 11:17 PM
Thank you Admin for saving our time. I was planning to watch Obama at 8 PM Thursday, but now, since IV has "set our expectations right", I would do something else.. like continue feeling miserable :mad:




We would be very happy, rather astounded if the President decides to do recapture and/or dependents exemption. This is one of those things where we would welcome to be wrong in our assessment. We have also separately asked and advocated for recapture and dependents exemptions but the truth is that the chances are very less for recapture and/or dependents recapture, and we are only helping you manage your expectations ahead of the announcement.

Now that is out of the way, let me mention this. It is because of immature folks who cannot have a civil discussion that it is difficult to share what we know. As soon as we share something real, there is always one to those idiot hiding somewhere who immediately pop-up its head just because he doesn't like the message. And then this group of mostly handful of immature folks start with attacking the messenger as if immediately the other person is the mortal enemy. Grow up please.

Administrator2
11-19-2014, 11:48 PM
Thank you Admin for saving our time. I was planning to watch Obama at 8 PM Thursday, but now, since IV has "set our expectations right", I would do something else.. like continue feeling miserable :mad:

You have got to be kidding me. If you are affected by green card backlog did you even care to read this thread. We have been telling all along that Recapture and Dependents Exemption do not have a real chance. It was a diversion created by companies and most of those articles were planted to create diversion. If you had unrealistic expectations, it was your fault because you did not filter facts from bullshit. How come that is President's fault? Recapture and Dependents Exemption cannot be done with Admin Fix, it will require act of Congress. What part of Admin fix do we not understand?

And do you even understand the implications and benefits of other fixes that are on the table?

I have to be honest. Get real because Washington is a town where no one cares for folks with unrealistic expectations.

The problem with sharing any fact is no matter what happens, there are always handful of people who will not benefit from whatever is happening. And those few handful of people are often be vocal making it look like whatever is happening is worthless. But the guys are will benefit will just watch silently. Sometimes I feel that its a pitty the immature manner we behave as a community.

legalimmi11
11-20-2014, 12:20 AM
Totally agree with Admin. You guys have amazing patience to explain each impatient and selfish individual who just care about his/her case. They don't care about community and future generation or some other folks who can get big relief from some of these fixes. This is such a historic development and high skilled people in this forum are behaving in such a cynical way.

I would suggest you to ignore these guys and posts. thanks once again !!

You have got to be kidding me. If you are affected by green card backlog did you even care to read this thread. We have been telling all along that Recapture and Dependents Exemption do not have a real chance. It was a diversion created by companies and most of those articles were planted to create diversion. If you had unrealistic expectations, it was your fault because you did not filter facts from bullshit. How come that is President's fault? Recapture and Dependents Exemption cannot be done with Admin Fix, it will require act of Congress. What part of Admin fix do we not understand?

And do you even understand the implications and benefits of other fixes that are on the table?

I have to be honest. Get real because Washington is a town where no one cares for folks with unrealistic expectations.

The problem with sharing any fact is no matter what happens, there are always handful of people who will not benefit from whatever is happening. And those few handful of people are often be vocal making it look like whatever is happening is worthless. But the guys are will benefit will just watch silently. Sometimes I feel that its a pitty the immature manner we behave as a community.

rupen
11-20-2014, 01:30 AM
If someone needs confirmation from other media reports of not having recapture, here we go

Obama Sets Immigration Rollout for This Week - WSJ (http://m.wsj.com/articles/obama-to-announce-executive-actions-on-immigration-friday-sources-say-1416410043?mobile=y)

arun_ramani
11-20-2014, 06:57 AM
Finally, we come to know that there is nothing substantial for legal immigrants especially those affected by back logs and this administration has sold message to advocacy groups that undocumented immigrants cause is more important than legal immigrants.

Also tech companies under the cover must have lobbied not to have any meaningful reform to clear back logs. This country needs indentured workers to ensure that political parties and companies work hand in hand to make profits and make life of potential immigrants miserable.

Please don't tell me that we need to work with local congressman and senators and participate in advocacy. I have done that in the past and have seen how that has played out.

We have been cornered and I don't see anyone really interested in allowing to solve our problems. Probably a couple of Indian - American senators. A wild imagination!!

rupen
11-20-2014, 07:26 AM
Finally, we come to know that there is nothing substantial for legal immigrants especially those affected by back logs and this administration has sold message to advocacy groups that undocumented immigrants cause is more important than legal immigrants.

Also tech companies under the cover must have lobbied not to have any meaningful reform to clear back logs. This country needs indentured workers to ensure that political parties and companies work hand in hand to make profits and make life of potential immigrants miserable.

Please don't tell me that we need to work with local congressman and senators and participate in advocacy. I have done that in the past and have seen how that has played out.

We have been cornered and I don't see anyone really interested in allowing to solve our problems. Probably a couple of Indian - American senators. A wild imagination!!

I understand your frustration that there is nothing in terms of green cards. This IV had told long time back but we were reluctant to accept because of what we were seeing in various news reports.

Having said that, let's also realize what we are getting is not small thing. Getting EAD for thousands of people stuck in green card backlog is a giant step forward from current situation. And it is just not ead, there are some provisions which will make existing ead provisions better like redefining "same or similar occupations", not having to restart green card process again when employer is changed. These provisions will ensure proprt job mobility and remove indebtitude currently present.

Let's be apreciative of what we are getting and congratulate IV for that because everyone else was focused on illusioned green cards when IV picked up these important things which could be done

2008candid
11-20-2014, 07:43 AM
I understand your frustration that there is nothing in terms of green cards. This IV had told long time back but we were reluctant to accept because of what we were seeing in various news reports.

Having said that, let's also realize what we are getting is not small thing. Getting EAD for thousands of people stuck in green card backlog is a giant step forward from current situation. And it is just not ead, there are some provisions which will make existing ead provisions better like redefining "same or similar occupations", not having to restart green card process again when employer is changed. These provisions will ensure proprt job mobility and remove indebtitude currently present.

Let's be apreciative of what we are getting and congratulate IV for that because everyone else was focused on illusioned green cards when IV picked up these important things which could be done

People are getting frustrated because of they are not getting what they expected. I never seen IV mentioned that GC will be available to all EB categories with EO, instead IV always remind G.C is not possible with EO. We are reading from different forums and other forums giving false hope. I think if we get what IV has lobbied for is a giant step, this is same like G.C only issue I see is our kids won't get higher education loan as G.C holders.

thokkalohdi
11-20-2014, 08:14 AM
I am a silent reader. Not a contributor due to my other beliefs. But, one thing i constantly see on this forum is about how less people show up for events and how less the funding is for this Advocacy.

One thing i do see is how organizations like TANA, ATA, BATA raise millions of dollars and conduct star-studded events and the attendance is in 1000s. I saw that 5000 people turned up to play "dandia" for SEF event in bay area with a entree fee on a average of 50$ per head.

So i believe that its not like Indian based EB applicants dont put down money or dont show up for events. That indicates that there is a huge gap between the expectation of immigration advocacy groups and understanding of "Advocacy strategy" among 1000s of applicants.

I want to know does IV partner with cultural organizations like TANA, ATA, BATA, etc to raise funds? Do you use that platform to talk about "Advocacy"?

Administrator2
11-20-2014, 08:30 AM
Finally, we come to know that there is nothing substantial for legal immigrants especially those affected by back logs and this administration has sold message to advocacy groups that undocumented immigrants cause is more important than legal immigrants.

Also tech companies under the cover must have lobbied not to have any meaningful reform to clear back logs. This country needs indentured workers to ensure that political parties and companies work hand in hand to make profits and make life of potential immigrants miserable.

Please don't tell me that we need to work with local congressman and senators and participate in advocacy. I have done that in the past and have seen how that has played out.

We have been cornered and I don't see anyone really interested in allowing to solve our problems. Probably a couple of Indian - American senators. A wild imagination!!


For anyone who is upset that recapture and/or dependent's exemption is not part of executive order:

Please read first post of this thread from over 3 months ago. And if you have time, read through rest of this thread. We have repeatedly shared that recapture and/or dependent's exemption is very difficult or rather outside of the realm of Executive Order.

If you have read lawyer's websites or other forms and somehow developed a notion that recapture and/or dependent's exemption is happening, then that is purely your fault. You can hear what you read in lawyer predictions or waste your time gossiping online. Or you can know the truth. Every day you make that choice for yourself. From how we see things, if you are upset, then it is your fault because in spite of our effort to share what was going on in the background, you have not done your homework to see through all the bullshit that was going around for months now.

Morale of the story

You can choose to waste your time loitering around forums or lawyers websites reading what you want to hear and what they want you to hear. Or you can participate in meaningful Advocacy. For a bill that will show up in next May 2015, that next round of effort is starting now. NO ONE can show up in May expecting to parachute their provision in the final bill just when it is about to be passed. If you want to see things change then get involved now. And please stop wasting your time reading prediction of lawyers or gossiping on online forums. You can do better than that. When a bill is passing on the House or Senate floor, or when EO contents are decided, we see some people start online petitions at that time. This is not insane behavior because for anyone who wants to make this country as your permanent home, people have to invest some time to learn how the system works. For if we decide not to invest that time, then we are guilty of not living up to our expectation.

Sorry Arun, to repeated this over and over again, but meeting with “local congressman and senators and participate in advocacy” is the only way. Advocacy is hard and it takes time. But that is the only way to fix the issue.

Administrator2
11-20-2014, 08:31 AM
Here is the link to first post of this thread if you haven't had a chance to read that until now:
Possible Administrative Fixes - Filtering facts from fiction - Immigration Voice (http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/forum16-iv-agenda-and-legislative-updates/3096036-possible-administrative-fixes-filtering-facts-from-fiction.html)

sengs
11-20-2014, 09:32 AM
NPR just announced that provision of business visa only includes "…… expansion of work visa for foreign graduates of US universities. President is leaving the rest for the Congress to work on. Business groups expected a recapture of unused visas, but according to WSJ that is not happening".

I don't know I will be happy or sad, because frankly I really don't think that media understands anything about legal immigration fiasco. I would rather wait to hear it straight from the horse's mouth, although my expectations are zero.

Thank you IV admin again, because whatever we will be getting today, big or small, would not have been possible without you.

gcbikari
11-20-2014, 09:41 AM
I am currently waiting for my nth EAD renewal, about to expire very shortly. I am greatly benefited if 240 day rule comes into affect. I won't complain for not getting GS immediately but understand IV and thank for your efforts. So if the EO is released, is it affective immediately?

Immigration Voice Newsletter: 11/19/2014


November 19, 2014 at 7:59am (https://www.facebook.com/notes/immigration-voice/immigration-voice-newsletter-11192014/817557368310489)
Dear Friends,

As many of you may have heard, President Obama’s administration is planning to announce immigration relief in the form of administrative reform in the next few days. While the exact details are unknown at this time, there are some specific reforms that we have requested (http://goo.gl/Cfg70C) the White House and the Department of Homeland Security’s policy makers for the skilled immigration system. We expect that many of these reforms are likely to be included in the package that is announced. This announcement may come as early as this week.

In addition to recapture of unused green cards and EAD for H-4 visa holders, Immigration Voice has pushed for many different quality of life fixes to the system. We expect that a combination of the following fixes, in some variation, will be announced very soon by the administration.


Allow applicant to submit and DHS to receive Adjustment of Status application when a visa number is not available.
Providing clarity to current law by clearly defining "Same or Similar Occupation Classification".
Providing the immigration case related paperwork to the beneficiary by USCIS and Department of Labor. Currently, immigrants do not have access to their own immigration paper work making them beholden to the employers, skewing the labor market.
Improving the system so that immigrants are not required to re-file and start employment based visa process all over again every time they change employer. This aspect of the system is being excessively abused by bad employers in marketplace to coerce and threaten immigrant employees from changing jobs, resulting in employee exploitation and preventing labor mobility.
Allow porting of Priority Date between primary applicant's Employment Based green card petition and Spouse's Employment Based green card petition.
Making Visa Bulletin 'Current' allowing applicants to adjust status.
Providing clarity for allowing immigrants to start companies and work for their own companies on Optional Practical Training (OPT), Employment Authorization Document (EAD) pending Adjustment of Status and H1-B visas, without impractical restrictions that are not required by the existing law.
Grant automatic extensions for 240 days of Work Authorization and Advance Parole if extension was filed prior to expiry of Work Authorization or Advance Parole.

We know that when we are restricted from freely moving in the market between employers and positions due to green card delays, it limits our potential to grow. It also binds us to our sponsoring employers and makes us more attractive as employees in hi-tech industry where employee turnover is high and employee retention is tough. Because of the unfair competition created by long green card backlogs, a US citizen cannot compete on a level playing field against an immigrant who is bonded to his or her employer. Freeing people to move between employers and positions helps us grow; level the playing field for US citizens for fair competition and is beneficial to overall economy. The same rationale applies to the less skills labor market largely filled in by the undocumented immigrants.

It is extremely important for us as a community of skilled immigrants to stand shoulder to shoulder alongside our brothers and sisters who are undocumented but have contributed to the economy of their adopted homeland, just like we have. It is very easy to get mired in the bristling politics of the issue, but we must keep in mind that the relief announced for the undocumented is long overdue and well deserved just like the relief that is announced for us. We have to stand in support of the administrative reform package when we talk to friends, colleagues, social media, press, public forums and policy makers – and speak with one voice. Making incendiary comments is not only wrong from moral perspective, it is also bad politics.

Although it is very easy to preach the virtue of the lawfulness, we have to remember that most of us, directly or indirectly, benefit from undocumented immigration. The very agitators, who might want to deport everyone, are the ones who live in houses that are built by undocumented immigrants; buy produce picked by undocumented immigrants and stay in hotel rooms maintained by the very undocumented immigrants they want to deport. They all reap benefits of cheap, exploited and helpless undocumented immigrants and yet refuse to let them be a part our society, just as skilled workers. We have to be careful and not get carried away by the tsunami of this hypocritical rant that is expected to follow the administrative reform.

As always, we will do our best to keep you informed as we hear more from policy makers and we thank you for your support and dedication to your noble cause.

Stay connected to know more and don't forget to contribute (http://donations.immigrationvoice.org (http://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fdonations.immigrationvoice.or g%2F&h=iAQEjH6lL&s=1))!

Aman Kapoor
Immigration Voice
www.ImmigrationVoice.org (http://www.ImmigrationVoice.org/)

aj2000
11-20-2014, 09:56 AM
:cool: Thank you for being a saint. God bless you all.


Totally agree with Admin. You guys have amazing patience to explain each impatient and selfish individual who just care about his/her case. They don't care about community and future generation or some other folks who can get big relief from some of these fixes. This is such a historic development and high skilled people in this forum are behaving in such a cynical way.

I would suggest you to ignore these guys and posts. thanks once again !!

amit_sp
11-20-2014, 10:57 AM
Hello Admin, I echo what legalimmi11 said. You guys have been doing a fantastic job all these years and most of the people are grateful to you. I got my GC mid of this year after almost 11 years but I am still a regular visitor and lifetime supporter. My sincere wishes for all the impacted people!!!

Pragneshs
11-20-2014, 11:15 AM
that's a great feedback for IV and I myself am a silent reader in this forum but let me tell everyone something. I was late in IV Advocacy efforts, however I did not miss single Advocacy in this year and my experience is amazing. I would say that people who are reading in other forums, media and Lawyers Website do not have direct relation with WH/DHS and I realized this the moment I became an active member in IV. I know what is coming now and what we should do as an individual.

I encourage everyone of you to fight for our G.C battle no matter what is the EO announcement today as if we are successful in a milestone then I think we have final milestone to go and imagine the power as a common man you will have once you have your EAD. we should unite, stand together and flood the whole HR/Senate building with people like us who want G.C in next Advocacy event.

Let me tell you a fact while I was in one of the Advocacy event, we meet thousands of group from one country fighting for their rights to help them even though they are migrated into this country and there voices were heard. not because they did advocacy but because the impact was so huge that they had to ACT.

I believe that whatever roadblocks we have for G.C can only be achieved by Legislative Action and I am no expert but thanks to the training of IV to give me the right Knowledge on how this system works and what it takes to change this system. imagine if you were in india the only solution is bribe, and on contrary the only solution in U.S is to STAND UP.

Lets unite together, come forward for next Advocacy Event and come in full force and demand for what we want and I AM 100% CONFIDENT we will get what we want in our final MILESTONE.

I also would encourage everyone to stop saying anything negative as we are inching closer to our goal and we are just waiting for a great American THANKSGIVING gift, lets appreciate all the hard work IV has done and celebrate it by uniting together in next Advocacy to get what we want. Trust me the more the merrier and the larger the impact, faster is our resolution.

sengs
11-20-2014, 11:48 AM
Thanks for the encouraging words. Let us keep our hopes up. Few more hours to go.

dhakaldoo
11-20-2014, 01:10 PM
To all those who are frustrated, Angry and are posting negative messages here on forum :
If you would have used this anger and came out to previous advocacies that would have been more beneficial. (Don’t tell me you did come to DC as if you had, then you wouldn’t post such messages)

Undocumented workers don’t have money neither do they have legal status. But so many of these keep showing up and meeting with congress and White house. If you come to think of it, it must take a lot of courage, keeping fear of getting arrested aside! It is do or die situation for them.
May be it is not a do or die situation for us. That’s why most of us prefer coming on this forum anonymously and post their rant and go away. When it comes to going to DC or donating money or being active at the local level, very very few people show up.

I have been a part of IV since 2011. I have seen, when HR 3012 was in works, the number of people attending advocacies was over 100. But as it died, the number reduced to like 30 for the latest advocacy. We need to understand it’s a process. Its not like one time you go to DC your job is done. There is a lot of background work that needs to be done. Its easy to come and say IV didn’t do any thing. If it was up to IV everybody in backlogs would get citizenship by now!


Now about this EO. President can only do limited. Visa recapture, Discounting dependents from visa number count, Removal of country caps, reducing the citizen ship wait time etc NEED congressional action. We really have to be Naïve to think that Just because we want, Obama can and will do all this. This has already been discussed with white house numerous times. But if you come to think, concurrent filing will also help a lot of people. Almost all of us will get EADs. Is that enough ? No! there is a long road ahead till the actual immigration reform is done. Advocacies will begin again. Will I be active? NO because Probably I will have an EAD :rolleyes: (Kidding)
We have long way to go! More in terms of getting our lazy community to act than getting actual bills passed! And that is the sad thing!

gc_check
11-20-2014, 02:01 PM
I see lots of activities on this site and also similar website / forum just before and after "any" immigration specific announcement, update, etc.. whether or not it includes anything specific to "your" interests or not. Observed this pattern for many years now. Any announcement contains information that is a result of actions from the past and if "we" din't act when the details or put together, there is no point in "whining" on what is there in it, when the announcement is made. If "EB" community needs to see anything specific to them, they must have acted before and not gather after the message is put together. That is what happening with the POTUS Executive Order this time. There are few hundred's acted on time, but this big mountain requires many thousands to move and you can't always expect the few hundreds acted on time will get this done every single time they try.. Folks like IV and other advocated for EB community, though they want, they can't get it done by themselves in real world. They need more hands to join them.

However anything that is in EO that might help any sector of the legal community is a welcome steps forward in my view.

neodyn55
11-20-2014, 05:25 PM
I've contributed to IV in the past, but I want to do more! I want to directly get involved in the advocacy efforts. How do I get started? I sent messages on Facebook and posts, but I haven't gotten any response. Admin, it would be great if you could put down a few concrete steps on how to get started (beyond just contributing) but actually get boots on the ground.

No matter what happens today, legislative changes are the only thing that is permanent. There's momentum building now and I want to help carry that forward.

Even if nothing happens, I can tell myself that I at least gave it an effort.

whiteStallion
11-20-2014, 06:28 PM
Some infographic from WH

Infographic: President Obama Is Taking Steps to Fix Our Broken Immigration System | The White House (http://www.whitehouse.gov/share/infographic-president-obama-taking-steps-fix-our-broken-immigration-system)

The one liner regarding legal immigration is upto interpretation though..

2008candid
11-20-2014, 06:32 PM
If this is true, it is really devastating
11/20/2014: Leaked Obama EO Plans Cause a Shock Wave and Rage in the "Legal" Foreign Workers Community

There is a report of the White House site on Obama's immigration executive action plans, which apparently has been leaked, shows that these executive action plans are practically limited to the relief of undocumented immigrants and there will be practically no relief for hightech foreign workers other than expansion of OPT programs and H-4 spouse EAD which has been stalled in the rule-making process pending this so-called Obama EO actions. We will see whether these leaked plans are indeed true White House sites. We will find out soon. Unreal!

Administrator2
11-20-2014, 06:55 PM
If this is true, it is really devastating
11/20/2014: Leaked Obama EO Plans Cause a Shock Wave and Rage in the "Legal" Foreign Workers Community

There is a report of the White House site on Obama's immigration executive action plans, which apparently has been leaked, shows that these executive action plans are practically limited to the relief of undocumented immigrants and there will be practically no relief for hightech foreign workers other than expansion of OPT programs and H-4 spouse EAD which has been stalled in the rule-making process pending this so-called Obama EO actions. We will see whether these leaked plans are indeed true White House sites. We will find out soon. Unreal!

Again, this analysis is totally wrong and we disagree. Whosoever is providing this analysis doesn't know what she/he is talking

Administrator2
11-20-2014, 06:59 PM
This is massively positive change for immigrants. Please do not be mired and confused by bullshit.

Here is just a handful of WINs for us.

1. Allow applicant to submit and DHS to receive Adjustment of Status application when a visa number is not available. (Will require Regulation process so it will be 6-7 months)
2. Providing clarity to current law by clearly defining "Same or Similar Occupation Classification". (Will not require Regulation, most likely through Memo)
3. Job portability so we will not have to restart green card process. Not allowed to revoke I-140
4. EAD for H-4 (Dec/Jan time frame).

We will provide a more detailed analysis soon along with all the other positive provisions in this change.

410,000 Employment Based immigrants will be directly positively impacted by these fixes. And if you add family members, the number would be more than half a million.

This is MOST SIGNIFICANT that can be done in Executive Order

neodyn55
11-20-2014, 07:02 PM
Sounds pretty good. I'd love to hear about #3 in particular.

hil3182
11-20-2014, 07:20 PM
If this is true, it is really devastating
11/20/2014: Leaked Obama EO Plans Cause a Shock Wave and Rage in the "Legal" Foreign Workers Community

There is a report of the White House site on Obama's immigration executive action plans, which apparently has been leaked, shows that these executive action plans are practically limited to the relief of undocumented immigrants and there will be practically no relief for hightech foreign workers other than expansion of OPT programs and H-4 spouse EAD which has been stalled in the rule-making process pending this so-called Obama EO actions. We will see whether these leaked plans are indeed true White House sites. We will find out soon. Unreal!

Sounds like a bunch of immigration lawyers pissed off about loosing their income stream from the constant H1 extensions.

Not one word about early filing and job mobility which will make the constant renewal of H1 unnecessary.

Administrator2
11-20-2014, 07:21 PM
There is lot to share, but again, as we kept on sharing for last 3 month, Recapture and Dependents exemption is not possible in this Executive Order.

Based on what we have honestly sharing all along, one could not have asked for more fixes that can be done without changing the law.

Everything that was possible has been done. THIS IS HUGE and will help folks stuck in current backlogs, and will help immigrants who will show up in the future.

This is a great day.

We request everyone to share this with friends and colleagues. The enthusiasm of the supports have to be many folds greater than the anger of opponents. We need everyone to go to FB, Twitter etc to express support for this positive change.

On twitter please use #ImmigrationAction

thokkalohdi
11-20-2014, 07:22 PM
1. Allow applicant to submit and DHS to receive Adjustment of Status application when a visa number is not available. (Will require Regulation process so it will be 6-7 months)

does that mean any1 with approved I140 can file for i765 and get an EAD?????

if thats true.. wowwwwwww

hil3182
11-20-2014, 07:42 PM
I have been to a couple of advocacy day events, never posted on the forum before because the quality of the conversation on an important matter has never been so poor.

All the noise about dependent exemption and green card recapture is just that - noise. The people asking for dependent exemption know that it is impossible. The main reason they are asking is the hope it will drown out more reasonable "asks" (in DC speak) like early filing of I-485 - which not co-incidentally the noise makers are completely silent about. Other reasons exist for the noise which I will not get into.

If you are wondering who the noisemakers are, all you have to do is figure out the losers with (say) the early I-485 fix (among our other asks). Immigration lawyers are an obvious suspect, hence the sight of them crawling out of the woodwork to opine on the dubious legality of the Dependent exemption - after not hearing a peep out of them on this matter in the last decade. Tech companies are another obvious suspect, we haven't heard any of them ask for anything other than more H1-B's, back door H1-B's, recapture and Dependent exemption.

Again, it is not a coincidence, that provisions which would benefit our community that the tech companies are making a noise about are unachievable "pie in the sky" asks.

You don't hear a peep about anything that is both achievable and would benefit us.

If you genuinely are on an H1 and want to see an improvement in your situation, you better hope and pray the dependent exemption and recapture noise does not drown out our more reasonable and achievable "asks" - which is exactly what the people that prey on us want.

I think now is a good time for me to quote my ealier post and make the following point: If you are a high skilled immigrant stuck in the Gren Card line, IV is the ONLY organization out there looking after your best interests.

The lawyers are after your fees, the companies are after your cheap labor, the lobbyists are after their commission and the lawmakes either want to use you as a vote bank or use you to scare their votebank.

They will waste your time with pie in the sky completely unacheivable asks like Green Card recapture or Dependent exemption - fully knowing that these things are impossible, but doing it anyway. They do this because they want to appear to be yor friends, but actually their best interests is in watching you suffer.

If IV hadn't presented the administration with options that were acheivable, the only thing they would have heard was this "noise" about dependents exemption and visa recapture. They predictably would have said "no" to it and there would have been nothing for us.

I would like to reiterate my earlier point - IV is the ONLY organization out there looking after your best interests.

Take a moment to think about his.

If you want to support IV, the thing to do is to start a monthly reoccuring donation at donations.immigrationvoice.org at a level you are comfortable with. A new Congress is coming to town with a different political dynamic and it would be remiss of us to not test the waters by pushing for our agenda - so watch this space for the next advocacy day event and join us.

gk_2000
11-20-2014, 07:53 PM
This is massively positive change for immigrants. Please do not be mired and confused by bullshit.

Here is just a handful of WINs for us.

1. Allow applicant to submit and DHS to receive Adjustment of Status application when a visa number is not available. (Will require Regulation process so it will be 6-7 months)
2. Providing clarity to current law by clearly defining "Same or Similar Occupation Classification". (Will not require Regulation, most likely through Memo)
3. Job portability so we will not have to restart green card process. Not allowed to revoke I-140
4. EAD for H-4 (Dec/Jan time frame).

We will provide a more detailed analysis soon along with all the other positive provisions in this change.

410,000 Employment Based immigrants will be directly positively impacted by these fixes. And if you add family members, the number would be more than half a million.

This is MOST SIGNIFICANT that can be done in Executive Order

Dear Aman
I am most euphoric on seeing #1. This is something I argued in these very forums many moons ago. Now to see how really it goes ..! (hope it will prove helpful enough)

pappu
11-20-2014, 07:56 PM
Time to celebrate is approaching. This is the fruit of our 9 year of hard work we will get today. It is going to be a historic moment. A lot of our items in the ask list for admin fix have been accepted. A very BIG WIN for Immigrationvoice today. We were at White House twice today for final meetings and we are very excited.

pappu
11-20-2014, 08:43 PM
Dear Friends,

We are pleased to announce that after almost 9 years of hard work on the issue of skilled immigration backlogs, we finally have good news to report. The Obama administration has issued an administrative order with reforms to both skilled immigration and other areas where reform was long overdue.

Going forward, it will be easier to use a new provision called “Pre-Register” where employees who have approved labor and I-140 would be able to gain benefits of adjustment of status even when the dates are not current. This has been, by far, the most sought after and in-demand provision for us in last 9 years. Skilled employees would be able to switch jobs, apply for EAD and advance parole and also not have to worry about the new job being the same or similar, as the new administrative order liberalizes the definition of what constitutes same or similar job. In addition to this, the administration is making it possible to port the green-card petition from one employer to another so that applicants do not have to start with labor certification again should their employment end after they are quite far along in the process.

Spouses who are on H-4 visa would be able to apply for work permit and receive EAD via the proposed H-4 EAD rule. Additionally, they will also qualify for an EAD through the pre-registration step with primary applicant of green-card process. This will make life easier for thousands of skilled family members who get left out of opportunities due to H1B quota restrictions.

We stood up for ourselves and started this organization 9 years ago with this goal. Other than additional visa numbers, every single one of our ask-list items has been included in the administrative reform. This has not been easy and it has not been automatic. Democracy operates slowly and certainly for those who stand up for themselves and speak out. This is the fruit of almost a decade of hard work of our organization and the members who’ve dedicated to this cause whole-heartedly, spent enormous amounts of money and stormed the DC policy circles even when there was a smallest ray of hope. We had a silver lining of hope with H.R. 3012, and now, today, we have bright sunny future ahead of us.

One final note, before we start celebrating, we have to be savvy and bold about this issue. We have to speak positively about this with social media, press, policy makers, friends, colleagues and everyone we discuss this with. Please do not get mired into the politically radioactive issue of undocumented immigrants who are also getting a well-deserved relief tonight. They are our brothers and sisters in this struggle and they deserve a break from congressional gridlock too. After all, when their family is hungry, they do not have the luxury of pontificating about the Hastert rule and Senate cloture motion requirements. They needed a break. So did we. And we got it.

With warm regards,
Aman Kapoor