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View Full Version : Why do IT consultants get to skip over US STEM graduates in the Green Card line?


saintforlife
03-17-2014, 05:32 AM
My background: EB2 category - Priority date is Sep 2012. I have a Master's Degree in Engineering from the US. Been in this country for 10 years, the last 7 of it on a H1B visa. So while I stare at the Sep 2004 priority date for EB2 India without any idea of when I'll ever get my Green Card, I hear stories of people from Infosys, Wipro and other consulting companies completing their 6 years of H1B, going back home to India just for a year, and then coming back and filing in EB1 category (under some imaginary International Manager category which makes them eligible for EB1) and getting their Green Card in only a couple of months. I think that is just bull shit, not the least because I don't have that option. I can't help but think that my career has regressed because of my choice to go to graduate school here. If I had just been another IT worker, I'd have my permanent residency and could be thinking about other things in life.

So why does the US immigration system penalize folks who actually went to graduate school here, paid tuition fees to universities, lived in this country for longer period of time, and paid more taxes, compared to these IT workers who come directly from India? What makes this IT consultant better than me? Why does he get to skip over me in line? Is it because he has a made-up international manager title? The whole think stinks to high heaven.

I hope any new immigration bill addresses this glaring ridiculousness of pooling all the people and all professions from one country together when giving out Green Cards.

pappu
03-17-2014, 07:53 AM
These kinds of topics are only good to fill up pages on forums so that more people write about them and increase page views and revenue of the website. But in reality it is a topic where nobody wants to complain.
I have mentioned a few times in the past too. If you think there is fraud come forward with proof, be prepared to take it up by leading it, going to authorities, be willing to stand up against it with your name on it, and be willing to go all the way to fix it even if you get your own green card during this. But so far in all these years not a single person has taken the challenge.
All people like to do is discuss discuss and sign some trash petitions .

My personal opinion is that many in the lower category or later priority date see people ahead of them as fraud. EB3 who cannot port sees EB2 as fraud. EB2 sees EB1 managers as fraud and all those who ported after him as fraud.

There is no solution to this . But I know the problem. The only problem is that we only think about ourselves and our greencard. Nobody cares about fixing the overall problem and look beyond their own dates. So this problem is unlikely to be ever solved.

looivy
03-17-2014, 01:51 PM
My background: EB2 category - Priority date is Sep 2012. I have a Master's Degree in Engineering from the US. Been in this country for 10 years, the last 7 of it on a H1B visa. So while I stare at the Sep 2004 priority date for EB2 India without any idea of when I'll ever get my Green Card, I hear stories of people from Infosys, Wipro and other consulting companies completing their 6 years of H1B, going back home to India just for a year, and then coming back and filing in EB1 category (under some imaginary International Manager category which makes them eligible for EB1) and getting their Green Card in only a couple of months. I think that is just bull shit, not the least because I don't have that option. I can't help but think that my career has regressed because of my choice to go to graduate school here. If I had just been another IT worker, I'd have my permanent residency and could be thinking about other things in life.

So why does the US immigration system penalize folks who actually went to graduate school here, paid tuition fees to universities, lived in this country for longer period of time, and paid more taxes, compared to these IT workers who come directly from India? What makes this IT consultant better than me? Why does he get to skip over me in line? Is it because he has a made-up international manager title? The whole think stinks to high heaven.

I hope any new immigration bill addresses this glaring ridiculousness of pooling all the people and all professions from one country together when giving out Green Cards.

Since you asked for a response..here it is

Because IT is doing things that makes enterprises move and you are just sitting in your lab with a test tube thinking that you are the smartest person on the planet.

krishmunn
03-17-2014, 04:59 PM
couple of reasons --

1) Because during your F1 visa interview you promised to return to your home country after completing your education which you broke

2) Because, you are not smarter than others to go for a EB1-EA or EB1-OR

3) Because your employer did not consider yourself to be valuable enough to start a GC process sooner

4) Because you are not complaining to USCIS against fraudulent Eb1-C that you know of (Looks like you know all of those cases are fraud :) )

5) Because anybody can spend truckload of money to get a US Degree from a barely accredited tier 4 school but that does not make one superior to others who did not have that much money

BTW, Career progression and regression is unrelated to GC.

saintforlife
03-17-2014, 07:46 PM
Since you asked for a response..here it is

Because IT is doing things that makes enterprises move and you are just sitting in your lab with a test tube thinking that you are the smartest person on the planet.
Good one. That was funny. I am pretty sure Windows system admins and SAP developers bring the same value to a company that engineers who are responsible for product development do. If engineers don't design new products that allow the companies to grow, there is nothing for the IT folks to 'move'.

saintforlife
03-17-2014, 08:12 PM
couple of reasons --

1) Because during your F1 visa interview you promised to return to your home country after completing your education which you broke

2) Because, you are not smarter than others to go for a EB1-EA or EB1-OR

3) Because your employer did not consider yourself to be valuable enough to start a GC process sooner

4) Because you are not complaining to USCIS against fraudulent Eb1-C that you know of (Looks like you know all of those cases are fraud :) )

5) Because anybody can spend truckload of money to get a US Degree from a barely accredited tier 4 school but that does not make one superior to others who did not have that much money

BTW, Career progression and regression is unrelated to GC.

Allow me to address your post point by point.

1) Because during your F1 visa interview you promised to return to your home country after completing your education which you broke - Irrelevant to this particular discussion. In any case I paid tuition fees and taxes for the 3 years I spent in grad school (not to mention assimilating into the American culture which is a big part of living in the US) which is more than can be said for an IT worker fresh off the boat.

2) Because, you are not smarter than others to go for a EB1-EA or EB1-OR - I believe this discussion is about the EB1-C category (or which ever that allows IT team leads in India declare themselves 'multi-national/international' managers. I will be the first to admit I am not as smart as a nobel prize winner or somebody that will find a cure to cancer or something. But I do believe I bring more value to my company as a design engineer than some of the other support roles.

3) Because your employer did not consider yourself to be valuable enough to start a GC process sooner - Way to make assumptions about my particular case. I promise you the fact that my employer didn't file the GC sooner has nothing to do with me not being valuable to the company. It's got more to do with me changing industries/careers.

4) Because you are not complaining to USCIS against fraudulent Eb1-C that you know of (Looks like you know all of those cases are fraud :) ) - These are stories I hear when I go to Indian community events and gatherings. I don't have any means to go after such people because it is a wasted effort. My energy is better spent elsewhere. Posting on a forum such as this is my way of venting. Also what is the point of going after somebody that already has their Green Card. My rant was about the stupid immigration rules. I don't fault people for taking advantage of a broken system, the same reason I don't fault GE and Apple failing to pay billions of dollars in corporate taxes by taking advantage of the loop holes in the American tax code. You don't want people to go around the system, fix the damn system.

5) Because anybody can spend truckload of money to get a US Degree from a barely accredited tier 4 school but that does not make one superior to others who did not have that much money - While there might be people who went to a barely accredited tier 4 school, there are tons of people who also went to some of the top schools in the entire world. Money has got nothing to do with it. If you have the desire to do something, you will figure out a way...take bank loans, work at McDonalds to pay your rent (like I did) etc. Most students who come here work very hard to take advantage of the opportunity. Nobody many people have $40-60K just lying around to pay tuition fees. It is a struggle for most people.

BTW, Career progression and regression is unrelated to GC. - Are you serious with this? Try telling that to someone whose labor was filed more than 8 years ago and is still waiting for his green card, but doesn't have the freedom to change jobs to do something new because it wasn't part of the original labor filing and will be told that the new role he is interested in too much of a job function change. What better example is there for a career stagnated by stupid immigration rules?

looivy
03-17-2014, 10:48 PM
Good one. That was funny. I am pretty sure Windows system admins and SAP developers bring the same value to a company that engineers who are responsible for product development do. If engineers don't design new products that allow the companies to grow, there is nothing for the IT folks to 'move'.


You are not designing sh#$. May be writing a small module or worse a subroutine.

Try being in SAP developer shoes for one day...they know more about dealing with stakeholders than you do.

saintforlife
03-18-2014, 02:20 AM
You are not designing sh#$. May be writing a small module or worse a subroutine.

Try being in SAP developer shoes for one day...they know more about dealing with stakeholders than you do.
What are you talking about? I am a mechanical design engineer. I don't deal with code or subroutines. I design things that actually do something in the real world. IT services exist because companies and corporations create real products. It is a support function. Modern companies existed for more than a hundred years before computers and IT services came along. Don't have an inflated sense of importance about what IT does. They exist to support an organization, the operative word being 'support'. By no means are they indispensable. They don't create shit.

Mechanical engineers, electrical engineers, algo engineers, firmware engineers, physics majors, computer science majors (and a myriad of experts from other science backgrounds) are the backbone of a company and make the company what it is. Not your SAP developer or some other low level IT person. What stakeholder will an IT person deal with if there are no tangible product or service on which a company is built upon? You are putting the cart before the horse. IT jobs exist because companies exist. Not the other way around.

krishmunn
03-18-2014, 08:52 AM
Irrelevant to this particular discussion.

--- What you promised during F1 is Very relevant. You have breached a promise. How can you be trusted ? .

In any case I paid tuition fees and taxes for the 3 years I spent in grad school (not to mention assimilating into the American culture which is a big part of living in the US) which is more than can be said for an IT worker fresh off the boat.

-- By your OWN admission , these IT workers spend 6 years on H1, then go back and return on L1. If you spent 3 years paying a meager tax, they paid tax for 6 years. Who is FOB ???

Way to make assumptions about my particular case. I promise you the fact that my employer didn't file the GC sooner has nothing to do with me not being valuable to the company. It's got more to do with me changing industries/careers.

---- No assumption. It does not take rocket science to understand your case. Elsewhere in this forum you have mentioned that you were on H4 for quite sometime -- aka you did not get a job. Your PD is 2012 aka you did not have an employer to file a GC before that. Remember , all these L1 - EB-C candidates are from major companies not a fly by night Desi Consulting company. So I do not suspect any money changing hands ... the company must see soem value


Also what is the point of going after somebody that already has their Green Card.

--- A Green Card can be revoked if it is obtained through fraud. It is within the law.
You are ranting and insulting people based on just some unsubstantiated stories. Your energy will be better spent on finding a confirmed case of fraud


While there might be people who went to a barely accredited tier 4 school, there are tons of people who also went to some of the top schools in the entire world.

-- And these people get their GC sooner than you .... they can apply on EB1, on EB2-NIW (where you do nto need to wait for an employer) , or are considered valuable by an employer who file GC much sooner in their career.

Money has got nothing to do with it. If you have the desire to do something, you will figure out a way...take bank loans,

--- Bank Loans .... probably you heard something called collateral. Banks DO NOT provide loans without a collateral. Since you are born with a silver spoon you have no idea how many people of India cannot afford a decent meal not to speak of collateral asked by bank.


work at McDonalds to pay your rent (like I did) etc.

--- Aha ! I will be happy to send this thread to USCIS . Let them dig out your real name . Did you have work authorization to work in McDonald ? Way too many students boast , I worked hard in Gas Station or Dunkin Donut etc. Illegaly. One more reason why you Should NOT have a Green Card over those who came and worked legally


Try telling that to someone whose labor was filed more than 8 years ago and is still waiting for his green card, but doesn't have the freedom to change jobs to do something new because it wasn't part of the original labor filing and will be told that the new role he is interested in too much of a job function change.

--- Your labor was filed in September 2012. My Math says it is not 8 years ago :)
BTW, you still have freedom to change job, new role etc. After your 140 is approved, you can carry your PD (that is not loss the position in queue) to a new job/role. Yes, the employer will need to file a new PERM and 140 again but that is what employer's do if they see value. Unfortunately, employers do not see at a degree from tier 4 university as a "value"

Tarang
03-18-2014, 08:58 AM
Let's not talk about fraud. Those EB1 multinational managers / executives use existing laws. Problem is with the law. If you are on H1B and working at same level as that manager / executive, you are not allowed to file under EB1 because you are not on L1A and you have not worked for that company for 1 year overseas in last 3 years. Not sure why that matters. Only thing which should matter is your current role/contribution to company which is same as other person on L1A.

krishmunn
03-18-2014, 09:02 AM
What are you talking about? I am a mechanical design engineer. I don't deal with code or subroutines. I design things that actually do something in the real world. IT services exist because companies and corporations create real products. It is a support function. Modern companies existed for more than a hundred years before computers and IT services came along. Don't have an inflated sense of importance about what IT does. They exist to support an organization, the operative word being 'support'. By no means are they indispensable. They don't create shit.



How you are doing your design -- using AutoCAD or something similar. Your company will be out of business if they are still doing things without using IT .
Remember you are using this forum -- courtesy IT.
From your Smartphone to Internet Banking to Word that you use to prepare your documents all somes from IT.
Sure companies existed before computers but they have changed their business model. In any case, it is NOT you to decide who is more important . It is for an Employer to decide who is more important. And the employers made you wait for years before filing GC ..... go ask your employer why they did not consider you indispensible

krishmunn
03-18-2014, 09:11 AM
Let's not talk about fraud. Those EB1 multinational managers / executives use existing laws. Problem is with the law. If you are on H1B and working at same level as that manager / executive, you are not allowed to file under EB1 because you are not on L1A and you have not worked for that company for 1 year overseas in last 3 years. Not sure why that matters. Only thing which should matter is your current role/contribution to company which is same as other person on L1A.

You DO NOT need to be on L1A to have EB1-C filed. Heck you do not even need to be in US to have it filed. EB1-C can be filed for people on H1 as well ... however the other part is true --- you shoud have worked for 1 year overseas in a managerial /supervisory role

imh1b
03-18-2014, 12:03 PM
If someone examines saintforlife history in USA many frauds will come out. He lied to get F1 visa. Then he worked illegally at McDees. Then he was on H4 because his so called valuable degree was not valuable to any employer in US. He then paid some desi consultant to get his H1. Then he worked on different sites against the USCIS memo for that desi consultant. He finally in 2012 and filed his labor. God knows what he did for his employer to have employer agree to file his labor. They were not filing his labor for many years as he was not valuable to them. Maybe he hired his own lawyer, paid money for labor and I140 etc, wrote and posted the recruitment ad with his lawyer.... all illegal. Now that he is stuck in backlogs he is calling others fraud.

Dude there is an extraordinary category in EB1. If you think you are so indespenible go get it.

One more thing. When I meet all these people who have so high notion of themselves and there top university degree and work profile. Why are you guys in USA. Your country needs you. Make your country India proud and a developed country. You flee the country due to greed by lying to visa officer and do not ever go back. Why?

imh1b
03-18-2014, 12:25 PM
Allow me to address your post point by point.

1) Because during your F1 visa interview you promised to return to your home country after completing your education which you broke - Irrelevant to this particular discussion. In any case I paid tuition fees and taxes for the 3 years I spent in grad school (not to mention assimilating into the American culture which is a big part of living in the US) which is more than can be said for an IT worker fresh off the boat.



What's with paying taxes. If you are in any country in the world, buying anything and earning any money or using its facilities YOU HAVE TO PAY TAX
It is the law of the land. You use its roads, go to shops and pay sales tax, and earn dollars and pay tax for the country and state.

What is the big deal about it. Just because you paid tax does not mean government will give you green card ?

Don't tell me you are assimilating in USA culture. I see so many Indians in USA. Large majority do not assimilate and do not like to even though they claim.
Tell me how have you assimilated? You must still smell of curry from your clothes. You must eat your food in your cubicle spreading curry smell in the office. Why can't you eat with Americans in cafeteria? why do you not go and socialize with American friends? Why do you have only desi parties and go to them? If you are talking about assimilating why you do not do community work? did you participate in any local activity yet? what charities do you support in USA Mr. high skilled, high value genius? What is your daily attire to office?- Formal shirt, non matching formal trousers and sport shoes :)?

When desis like you who think so high of themselves and genius talk about having paid taxes and assimilated and should now get green card ASAP because it is their right, I get infuriated.

Greencard is a privilege and not your right. This country belongs to US citizens. It has the most generous immigration system in the world. But that does not mean anyone and everyone from any country can be allowed to come in because he paid taxes and claims to be assimilated. Get that.

gcharry
03-18-2014, 01:59 PM
imh1b Senior Member,

If you get infuriated, go out and take a deep breath and relax man. It helps. Did you check your Blood Pressure recently? Respect someone's opinion. Remember, if you get angry its not good for you.

btw, you don't have to pay taxes in all the countries.

imh1b
03-18-2014, 02:47 PM
imh1b Senior Member,

If you get infuriated, go out and take a deep breath and relax man. It helps. Did you check your Blood Pressure recently? Respect someone's opinion. Remember, if you get angry its not good for you.

btw, you don't have to pay taxes in all the countries.

You are mistaken my friend. Some countries like oil rich countries or Tax haven countries like Bermuda and Caymen Islands have no income tax. But they do have indirect taxes. One way or another country raises money through taxes and duties. The point of argument was that this dude was boasting that he paid taxes in USA so now the Mayor of his town should come to his house and deliver his green card immediately. :)

gcharry
03-18-2014, 03:23 PM
imh1b,

"The point of argument was that this dude was boasting that he paid taxes in USA so now the Mayor of his town should come to his house and deliver his green card immediately."

That's funny. You made me to laugh, perhaps other too. Thanks.

AceMan
03-18-2014, 03:57 PM
My background: EB2 category - Priority date is Sep 2012.

Oh my god!!! Wow, you have waited more than 500 days!!!


I have a Master's Degree in Engineering from the US.

You must be really good. Not everybody has a Master's Degree in Engineering from the US.


Been in this country for 10 years, the last 7 of it on a H1B visa.

3652 days at least in US !!! what an achievement. And 7 years on H1B mind blowing !!!


So while I stare at the Sep 2004 priority date for EB2 India without any idea of when I'll ever get my Green Card,


You should buy an Idea Mobile from India. Kya Idea sirji !!!


I hear stories of people from Infosys, Wipro and other consulting companies completing their 6 years of H1B, going back home to India just for a year, and then coming back and filing in EB1 category (under some imaginary International Manager category which makes them eligible for EB1) and getting their Green Card in only a couple of months.

Even I know this for a fact. I did not know that they were imaginary. May be we


I think that is just bull shit, not the least because I don't have that option.

Kya vichar hain sirji !!! wah wah wah


I can't help but think that my career has regressed because of my choice to go to graduate school here.

No sir. You are an inspiration for lot of us IT people, who feels very sleepy during afternoon, staring at tons of code, and pretend to work.


If I had just been another IT worker, I'd have my permanent residency and could be thinking about other things in life.

Some might say sour grapes for this. But please ignore them.


So why does the US immigration system penalize folks who actually went to graduate school here, paid tuition fees to universities, lived in this country for longer period of time, and paid more taxes, compared to these IT workers who come directly from India?

Very good question. It is very nice. Lets go to the next question.


What makes this IT consultant better than me? Why does he get to skip over me in line? Is it because he has a made-up international manager title? The whole think stinks to high heaven.

Oh never. You are the best. Unlike you, they don't have any other choices and they are useless. So they need some help from the law like the reservation system in India.


I hope any new immigration bill addresses this glaring ridiculousness of pooling all the people and all professions from one country together when giving out Green Cards.


Sure sirji !!! done.. Aur kya chahiye is key saat? I recommend sweet lassi.

saintforlife
03-19-2014, 02:38 AM
I think this thread has gone to the gutter and turned into a pissing contest. There is no saving it anymore. I'll address a couple of things and I am out.

To the person that thinks I am a fraud based on my previous post history - when I first made my account on here a few years ago to ask about switching from H4 to H1B visa, it was for my wife, not me. I have found that in forums like this you have a better chance of getting a quick reply if you keep your question simple and short. So whoever you are can pat yourself on your back for the fine detective work. Too bad your 'gotcha' moment wasn't meant to be.

Also regarding the question about why my company took so long to file my green card - My first job was with a European company that had a strict policy of not sponsoring green cards unless you were in high-level management. Anybody who had worked in the energy industry will know which company this is. They wanted people to work all over the world and not try to use them only to get permanent residency in the US. I took a job with them because it was a great opportunity coming out of grad school. But then within a few months of starting the big recession hit and there was no way I could have risked moving to a different company in that job environment. Then after 4 years when things started looking up and the economy recovered, I moved a new company that immediately filed my green card. My first company not sponsoring my GC immediately had nothing to do with me. It was a company policy.

The funny thing about this thread is that I don't even care about the IT managers who get their green cards in the short span of time by showing some 'manager' experience in India and in the US. Frankly if I were in the position I'd done the same thing. I know they aren't breaking any laws but just taking advantage of a broken system. But my problem is with the whole immigration policy of this country that makes people from certain countries wait for up to a decade when they know the backlogs are piling up and still don't do anything to address it.

Good luck to y'all.

saintforlife
03-19-2014, 02:44 AM
What's with paying taxes. If you are in any country in the world, buying anything and earning any money or using its facilities YOU HAVE TO PAY TAX
It is the law of the land. You use its roads, go to shops and pay sales tax, and earn dollars and pay tax for the country and state.

What is the big deal about it. Just because you paid tax does not mean government will give you green card ?

Don't tell me you are assimilating in USA culture. I see so many Indians in USA. Large majority do not assimilate and do not like to even though they claim.
Tell me how have you assimilated? You must still smell of curry from your clothes. You must eat your food in your cubicle spreading curry smell in the office. Why can't you eat with Americans in cafeteria? why do you not go and socialize with American friends? Why do you have only desi parties and go to them? If you are talking about assimilating why you do not do community work? did you participate in any local activity yet? what charities do you support in USA Mr. high skilled, high value genius? What is your daily attire to office?- Formal shirt, non matching formal trousers and sport shoes :)?

When desis like you who think so high of themselves and genius talk about having paid taxes and assimilated and should now get green card ASAP because it is their right, I get infuriated.

Greencard is a privilege and not your right. This country belongs to US citizens. It has the most generous immigration system in the world. But that does not mean anyone and everyone from any country can be allowed to come in because he paid taxes and claims to be assimilated. Get that.

You need help. Take a deep breath and let it go like the other poster suggested. Nothing you or I say anonymously on an online forum will affect anything in our personal lives. Life will go on. Stop taking stuff so seriously man.

saintforlife
03-19-2014, 03:02 AM
Irrelevant to this particular discussion.

--- What you promised during F1 is Very relevant. You have breached a promise. How can you be trusted ? .

In any case I paid tuition fees and taxes for the 3 years I spent in grad school (not to mention assimilating into the American culture which is a big part of living in the US) which is more than can be said for an IT worker fresh off the boat.

-- By your OWN admission , these IT workers spend 6 years on H1, then go back and return on L1. If you spent 3 years paying a meager tax, they paid tax for 6 years. Who is FOB ???

Way to make assumptions about my particular case. I promise you the fact that my employer didn't file the GC sooner has nothing to do with me not being valuable to the company. It's got more to do with me changing industries/careers.

---- No assumption. It does not take rocket science to understand your case. Elsewhere in this forum you have mentioned that you were on H4 for quite sometime -- aka you did not get a job. Your PD is 2012 aka you did not have an employer to file a GC before that. Remember , all these L1 - EB-C candidates are from major companies not a fly by night Desi Consulting company. So I do not suspect any money changing hands ... the company must see soem value


Also what is the point of going after somebody that already has their Green Card.

--- A Green Card can be revoked if it is obtained through fraud. It is within the law.
You are ranting and insulting people based on just some unsubstantiated stories. Your energy will be better spent on finding a confirmed case of fraud


While there might be people who went to a barely accredited tier 4 school, there are tons of people who also went to some of the top schools in the entire world.

-- And these people get their GC sooner than you .... they can apply on EB1, on EB2-NIW (where you do nto need to wait for an employer) , or are considered valuable by an employer who file GC much sooner in their career.

Money has got nothing to do with it. If you have the desire to do something, you will figure out a way...take bank loans,

--- Bank Loans .... probably you heard something called collateral. Banks DO NOT provide loans without a collateral. Since you are born with a silver spoon you have no idea how many people of India cannot afford a decent meal not to speak of collateral asked by bank.


work at McDonalds to pay your rent (like I did) etc.

--- Aha ! I will be happy to send this thread to USCIS . Let them dig out your real name . Did you have work authorization to work in McDonald ? Way too many students boast , I worked hard in Gas Station or Dunkin Donut etc. Illegaly. One more reason why you Should NOT have a Green Card over those who came and worked legally


Try telling that to someone whose labor was filed more than 8 years ago and is still waiting for his green card, but doesn't have the freedom to change jobs to do something new because it wasn't part of the original labor filing and will be told that the new role he is interested in too much of a job function change.

--- Your labor was filed in September 2012. My Math says it is not 8 years ago :)
BTW, you still have freedom to change job, new role etc. After your 140 is approved, you can carry your PD (that is not loss the position in queue) to a new job/role. Yes, the employer will need to file a new PERM and 140 again but that is what employer's do if they see value. Unfortunately, employers do not see at a degree from tier 4 university as a "value"

I was going to ignore your post for its sheer ridiculousness, but you make some wild accusations that I want to address.

I came here on an F1 visa. I wanted to go back after my Master's degree. Just when I was about to graduate a company offered a job and said that they would file my H1B visa (which comes with an intent to immigrate). How is this a breach of any promise? If I did something unlawful, USCIS would have denied my H1B petition and told me to go back home because that is I told the immigration office when I first got my F1 visa. But they didn't. Come on dude.

Do you know there are McDonald's, Subways and other restaurant chains on campus at many US universities? Do you know that students on F1 visa can work any job on campus legally even if it is a McDonald's? You'd know that if you went to school here. Again, no 'gotcha' moment for you.

When I said "try telling that to someone whose labor was filed 8 years ago", I wasn't talking about my own case. It was a hypothetical scenario that could very well happen to someone who was in the EB3 category. I mentioned in my OP itself that my PD is only Sep 2012. Why would I contradict myself just a few posts later? You give me too little credit.

krishmunn
03-19-2014, 08:41 AM
I was going to ignore your post for its sheer ridiculousness, but you make some wild accusations that I want to address.

I came here on an F1 visa. I wanted to go back after my Master's degree. Just when I was about to graduate a company offered a job and said that they would file my H1B visa (which comes with an intent to immigrate). How is this a breach of any promise? If I did something unlawful, USCIS would have denied my H1B petition and told me to go back home because that is I told the immigration office when I first got my F1 visa. But they didn't. Come on dude.

Do you know there are McDonald's, Subways and other restaurant chains on campus at many US universities? Do you know that students on F1 visa can work any job on campus legally even if it is a McDonald's? You'd know that if you went to school here. Again, no 'gotcha' moment for you.

When I said "try telling that to someone whose labor was filed 8 years ago", I wasn't talking about my own case. It was a hypothetical scenario that could very well happen to someone who was in the EB3 category. I mentioned in my OP itself that my PD is only Sep 2012. Why would I contradict myself just a few posts later? You give me too little credit.


Nice coverup stories --- question for H4 to H1 was for my wife not me (so does she work for a shady IT consultant who files a self paid H1 but has no job ?), I worked on campus blah blah . If you had relly worked on campus you would have said , "I worked on campus" instead of saying I worked for McDonalds .

Bottomline --- NO ONE cut your line and moved ahead. While you were busy attending a tier 4 school burning your parent's money , they were busy working for a MNC . It is just that with their qualification and experience they got an employer willing to file a GC.

Unfortunately, you could not get an employer who would file a GC for you ... It was YOUR decision to join an employer who would not sponsor a GC so why blame others ?

BTW, all F1 students come here with an intent to go back but somehow "find" an employer to sponsor H1 and then stay back. The story is old .... do not ask us to believe that you "wanted to go back after Master's degree" and now begging for a Green Card :)

krishmunn
03-19-2014, 08:48 AM
I was going to ignore your post for its sheer ridiculousness, but you make some wild accusations that I want to address.

I came here on an F1 visa. I wanted to go back after my Master's degree. Just when I was about to graduate a company offered a job and said that they would file my H1B visa (which comes with an intent to immigrate). How is this a breach of any promise? If I did something unlawful, USCIS would have denied my H1B petition and told me to go back home because that is I told the immigration office when I first got my F1 visa. But they didn't. Come on dude.



So what you are saying is , you took advantage of the broken system much like you accuse the EB-1C candidates taking advantage of broken system. It is alright when you take advantage of broken system but it is all wrong when others take advantage of it ... nice thinking.

Why not ask CIS to fix the F1 policy --- one need to return to the home country after completing studies per their original "declared" intent. Let's ask them to fix this policy , revoke your H1 and send you back. Are you with me ?

krishmunn
03-19-2014, 09:00 AM
When I said "try telling that to someone whose labor was filed 8 years ago", I wasn't talking about my own case. It was a hypothetical scenario that could very well happen to someone who was in the EB3 category. I mentioned in my OP itself that my PD is only Sep 2012. Why would I contradict myself just a few posts later? You give me too little credit.

Nice to know you are thinking of others and not yourself . But did you Read what I said ?

You NEED NOT be stagnant because a PERM and 140 was filed. After the 140 is approved, you can move to a new employer/role and still retain your position in queue. It does not matter if the new role is significantly different (that is how people do porting BTW).

So your deduction that GC blocks your career progression is incorrect. Of course, you need an employer who is ready to file a new GC but for intellectuals like you it should not be a problem -- after all you keep the company moving unlike some ignorant IT parasites :rolleyes:

krishmunn
03-19-2014, 10:35 AM
I think this thread has gone to the gutter and turned into a pissing contest. .

For once, I agree with you ... but guess what you started this contest by pissing at the IT consultants from India . This is exactly what you said "So why does the US immigration system penalize folks who actually went to graduate school here, paid tuition fees to universities, lived in this country for longer period of time, and paid more taxes, compared to these IT workers who come directly from India?"

Just get it into your head -- you are no superior than the "IT workers who come directly from India" just because you had enough money to burn in a tier 4 school.

I see this hot air in many (not all) of the US educated folks -- we are superior than whoever is educated in India . Unless you have been to something like Harvard .MIT, Wharton (or something in same category) don't try to blow the trumpet of your "superior skills". It all ends in what your employer sees in you .... and if an employer is not willing to file a GC (or you do not find an employer who is willing to do that) all your hot air is just that --- hot air .

AceMan
03-19-2014, 10:53 AM
When you start a pissing competition, there are many people who willingly take part. US immigration rules are there for a reason. Unfair for you, may be, but that's the rule. You have every right to be frustrated. I can only empathize for you.

However when you start an allegation stating that managers of reputed companies like Infosys, Wipro etc are all frauds and jumping immigration lines based on the hear say at some Indian house function people will definitely question you.

You claim to have done your masters here in 2000's. You would have definitely been aware of the green card backlog. Had you been smart enough about GC, you would have married an American citizen and got your position lot different. This is just an observation and no way I am questioning your personal choices.

You have got a misplaced notion that your mechanical engineering background puts you in a higher pedestal. Sorry to prick your balloon, any person with any background have the right to aspire for a better standing in life.

I am an ECE engineer by qualification, but I switched to computer programming for a career. That is where the money was in late 90's. Did I miss working in chips? Am I happy writing subroutines and procedures? Do I feel happy when new guys get hired as the managers who got no clue of what they are doing?

Even though the answer is no, what I know is every 2nd week I get a paycheck which helps me pay my bills and mortgages. I respect it very much and try to be honest with the work I am hired to do.

I am doing my GC in EB3 2011. Am I annoyed? Yes, I am.. with 15 years of experience and a masters in engineering, I had every right to be pissed. But what was I hired for? I applied for a position which required 3 years experience and basic degree. The company determined that position is only eligible for EB3 and it was my choice to take it or leave it.

Do I have any options? Yes I do. I can join our vendors (TCS, Infosys, CTS, etc.) at a very high position, since I am joining from a client, position myself for an EB2. Even better I can join them and go to India as a manager and come back to US after an year on L1A and get my GC process in EB1.

If this works for some, why should they care about dogs barking fraud?

pappu
03-19-2014, 12:15 PM
Some posters raised good points even though it was back and forth. Some thoughts from my experience over many years dealing with this issue:

- When I meet people fresh off F1 into H1B, I ask them if they are in Greencard Queue yet. Most say they are not worried and their company and its lawyers will do it anyways when they ask for it later after a few years. This is a big mistake in my opinion. If someone wants green card, they should work on it from day one of H1B even if means changing jobs immediately. I also meet people who are at the end of H1B and do not have green card application, got laid off, company bought off, merged and they desperately seek solutions. Then there are people like the OP on the thread whose application was filed late and probably on H1B extensions or EAD. When they say economy was bad, I do not agree with it. If you look at the data from DOL and USCIS, there were a lot of applications filed even during those years. Lastly company policy excuse does not make sense. It is something HR may have used to satisfy an employee. Company policy is not like a federal law that is set in stone and to change it you need a long process. If an employee is valuable to company, any big or small company will do everything to keep him/her.

- When someone expresses frustration suddenly after many years of being an inactive IV member and questions laws and unfairness, I ask myself why is he saying that now? I do not know the answer yet to this question. The other answer I do not yet know is such people after expressing disappointment, go away and do nothing about it. Why?

Lastly I wanted to ask people to get active on IV Facebook page. We post a lot of information there. It is a better platform now for the kind of work we do. 'Like' it to get feed of the information and participate in discussions.

Desertfox
03-19-2014, 07:01 PM
I have the perfect welcome message for our new members reading this thread -

Welcome to the world of crabs where bandwagons are cheap!:D