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View Full Version : DHS wants green card holders' fingerprints


pappu
12-26-2008, 11:44 PM
http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-10126625-38.html
Millions of green card holders will be fingerprinted and photographed every time they enter the United States as part of an expansion of a controversial biometric program, the U.S. Department of Homeland Security announced on Thursday.
The expansion of the US-VISIT program to permanent residents--also known as green card holders--takes effect on January 18, 2009. At the moment, the program's biometric requirements apply to foreign citizens with a non-immigrant visa or those traveling as part of the so-called Visa Waiver program.
Anyone screened as part of the US-VISIT program must provide digital fingerprints and a photograph at the border, plus date of birth, address while in the country, and other information that the U.S. government deems appropriate. The information is checked against a government database of known terrorists and criminals. Refusing to give prints of all 10 fingers will result in being denied entry to the country.
"Expanding enrollment in US-VISIT is a positive step forward in a process designed to further improve public safety and national security while ensuring the integrity of the immigration system," the DHS said in a statement. "Linking a person's biometric information to his or her travel documents reduces the risk that a traveler's identity or documents could be intentionally misused by someone attempting to gain entry into the United States."
The program has been controversial. Government auditors have concluded that US-VISIT has "significant information security control weaknesses that place sensitive and personally identifiable information at increased risk of unauthorized and possibly undetected disclosure and modification, misuse, and destruction." Privacy groups have called it the "most elaborate system of identification in the United States."
Some visitors to the U.S. will continue to remain exempt, including non-U.S. citizens younger than 14 or older than 79, as well as Canadian citizens on short-term visits under B visas. US-VISIT stands for United States Visitor and Immigrant Status Indicator Technology.
The program was implemented in 2003, but a report (PDF) released by the Government Accountability Office this month details the shortcomings of the program, noting that "program planning and execution limitations and weaknesses...confront DHS in its quest to deliver US-VISIT capabilities and value in a timely and cost-effective manner."
The report said the DHS has not taken action to address some of the program's risks, even though they have been known for years. While the department has taken many steps aimed at improving the management of US-VISIT, the report said, more needs to be done, or else "program performance, transparency, and accountability will suffer."
Privacy and security are two of the main challenges facing US-VISIT, its chief information officer said at a biometrics conference in October. However, the program has virtually erased the once-prominent problem of document fraud at U.S. borders, its director said.
The Department of Homeland Security has not announced any plans to fingerprint U.S. citizens at the border. When going through the green card process, current applicants are required to be fingerprinted.

bharol
12-27-2008, 04:20 AM
http://www.itexaminer.com/us-wants-to-fingerprint-indian-green-card-holders.aspx

This link suggests it is only for Indian nationals!

Green_Always
12-27-2008, 01:15 PM
Before they issue GC they have taken all 10 finger prints and Bio-metrics, without this they wont issue Physical GC right ?

Now what again they need finger prints when ever we go out and come to this country ?

someone changing fingers out side this country ?

gc4me
12-27-2008, 04:34 PM
Finger printing expires. So it makes sense for DHS to ask for finger printing for GC holders. Not a big deal. I think this is even better for US security.


Before they issue GC they have taken all 10 finger prints and Bio-metrics, without this they wont issue Physical GC right ?

Now what again they need finger prints when ever we go out and come to this country ?

someone changing fingers out side this country ?

Pineapple
12-27-2008, 05:26 PM
..

someone changing fingers out side this country ?

That's funny :)

kittu1991
12-27-2008, 08:04 PM
:confused::confused:I totally agree that this is better for US security. Then why don't they do the same for US citizens. If GC holders can be threat to US security, US citizens can certainly be, especially in these times of depression.


Finger printing expires. So it makes sense for DHS to ask for finger printing for GC holders. Not a big deal. I think this is even better for US security.

bharol
12-28-2008, 03:28 AM
:confused::confused:I totally agree that this is better for US security. Then why don't they do the same for US citizens. If GC holders can be threat to US security, US citizens can certainly be, especially in these times of depression.

Idea of finger printing is not bad. But it should be done on citizens as well.

GC holders are future citizens. This does not make sense to me that I, or
somebody needs to be tracked when he/she is on GC and as soon as he/she gets citizenship, does not need to be tracked!


In fact GC holders are supposed to notify of address change when they move,
citizens are not supposed to do so. GC holders go through FBI name check as well before they get GC.
So GC holders are scrutinized more than natural born citizens anyway!

conundrum
12-28-2008, 12:20 PM
I guess they are implemening it in stages. Now it is for GC holder, maybe in a few years everyone including citizens might have to be fingerprinted.

solaris27
01-27-2009, 08:37 AM
they just want to secure us and as a gc hholder i don't have any problem.

but do they have resource ?

redgreen
01-27-2009, 11:23 AM
Why people are so much furious about even finger printing? It is one of the security related regulations and how does it hurt most of us (those who are not planning to be a criminal or allow somebodyelse to enter usa with our GC/visa)?

gcdreamer05
01-27-2009, 11:41 AM
Just be patient and allow them to do watever they want, finger print, leg print, mouth print or any print..... all they can do is just for 5 years after that you are citizen then whatever applies to otehrs apply for you.........

So just go with the flow....

If they say they will give GC tomorrow, i am ready to give finger prints daily also :D

NKR
01-27-2009, 11:47 AM
I do not mind giving finger prints any number of time, but first give me my green card pls...

reddog
01-27-2009, 12:10 PM
Just be patient and allow them to do watever they want, finger print, leg print, mouth print or any print..... all they can do is just for 5 years after that you are citizen then whatever applies to otehrs apply for you.........

So just go with the flow....

If they say they will give GC tomorrow, i am ready to give finger prints daily also :D

Never let anyone discriminate you.
When the holocaust happened, Jews were actually in denial.

And even if you are doing it, dont say it is OK.
bcos it is NOT OK.

ajju
01-27-2009, 02:27 PM
Never let anyone discriminate you.
When the holocaust happened, Jews were actually in denial.

And even if you are doing it, dont say it is OK.
bcos it is NOT OK.

Once you get citizenship it will say all naturalized citizens will need to give FP.. So we'll always be descriminated.. Live with it.. But its NOT OKAY... and we shouldn't accept it even it we cooperate (no choice here :-)) its still not acceptable to get descrminated... anyone and everone is a potential threat.. so make a more sensible and humane rule/law...

new_horizon
01-27-2009, 02:33 PM
fully agree with you.



Just be patient and allow them to do watever they want, finger print, leg print, mouth print or any print..... all they can do is just for 5 years after that you are citizen then whatever applies to otehrs apply for you.........

So just go with the flow....

If they say they will give GC tomorrow, i am ready to give finger prints daily also :D

NolaIndian32
01-27-2009, 02:53 PM
Before they issue GC they have taken all 10 finger prints and Bio-metrics, without this they wont issue Physical GC right ?

Now what again they need finger prints when ever we go out and come to this country ?

someone changing fingers out side this country ?

good one!! :D

wahwah
03-22-2009, 10:04 PM
after having been in the US for over 14 years, i finally received my green card. i was excited that i would not have to wait in the visitors line.

BUT GUESS WHAT??? because of this new US-VISIT biometrics rule, i was made to stand in the visitors line again and not in the US Citizens/Permanent Residents line. Now there is a separate line only for US citizens and LPR's have to stand in line with the visitors.

this really sucks...

deba
03-22-2009, 10:31 PM
What was your port of entry? I just came back to US after traveling and there is a separate line for Citizens and Residents and I went thru as a LPR. Fingerprinting? Yes but very few questions and smooth process. A very welcoming and smiling CBP officer. It seems quite unusual that you were asked to stand in the visitors' line.

ski_dude12
03-22-2009, 10:35 PM
Can you please remove the link in your signature. Looks like you are promoting your business here...

they just want to secure us and as a gc hholder i don't have any problem.

but do they have resource ?

wahwah
03-22-2009, 11:32 PM
this was at the chicago o'hare airport. the typical US citizens/LPR line now only mentioned US citizens, apparently the LPR text has been removed from the sign board.

i asked the officer about whether this was temporary and he mentioned that ICE was planning to install fingerprinting devices at all the booths but since the US citizens booth didn;t have these biometric devices they aasked all LPR's to stand in the visitors line.

where was your poe? were their biometric devices at the US citizens/lpr booths?


What was your port of entry? I just came back to US after traveling and there is a separate line for Citizens and Residents and I went thru as a LPR. Fingerprinting? Yes but very few questions and smooth process. A very welcoming and smiling CBP officer. It seems quite unusual that you were asked to stand in the visitors' line.

sk2006
03-23-2009, 02:04 AM
this was at the chicago o'hare airport. the typical US citizens/LPR line now only mentioned US citizens, apparently the LPR text has been removed from the sign board.

i asked the officer about whether this was temporary and he mentioned that ICE was planning to install fingerprinting devices at all the booths but since the US citizens booth didn;t have these biometric devices they aasked all LPR's to stand in the visitors line.

where was your poe? were their biometric devices at the US citizens/lpr booths?

I am wondering why they don't finger print citizens.
If GC can be faked, so can be US Passport!

GC holders in fact already are in the system and are finger printed before issuing GC..hence are better tracked than natural born citizens.

sk2006
03-23-2009, 02:07 AM
What was your port of entry? I just came back to US after traveling and there is a separate line for Citizens and Residents and I went thru as a LPR. Fingerprinting? Yes but very few questions and smooth process. A very welcoming and smiling CBP officer. It seems quite unusual that you were asked to stand in the visitors' line.

Deba,
What was your POE?

GCNirvana007
03-23-2009, 04:39 AM
before they issue gc they have taken all 10 finger prints and bio-metrics, without this they wont issue physical gc right ?

Now what again they need finger prints when ever we go out and come to this country ?

Someone changing fingers out side this country ?
:d:d

sayantan76
03-23-2009, 10:17 AM
Originally Posted by gcdreamer05
Just be patient and allow them to do watever they want, finger print, leg print, mouth print or any print..... all they can do is just for 5 years after that you are citizen then whatever applies to otehrs apply for you.........

So just go with the flow....

If they say they will give GC tomorrow, i am ready to give finger prints daily also

I think its views like this which have made GC and Citizenship such seemingly precious commodities that the grantors of such privileges (USCIS/ DHS etc) have come to believe that they can do whatever they want (delays/ arbitrary rules etc) and still there will be enough willing applicants in line for them to choose from to grant these "precious" privileges.........

I have had a GC now for 2 years - i dont think its made any material change in my life....i still work for the same company i used to before i got GC.........i was never discriminated against in the workplace prior to GC so nothing changed post GC either........the only advantage to me has been that I can visit Canada (which i have to often for business) without a visa.........

axp817
03-23-2009, 10:56 AM
Originally Posted by gcdreamer05
Just be patient and allow them to do watever they want, finger print, leg print, mouth print or any print..... all they can do is just for 5 years after that you are citizen then whatever applies to otehrs apply for you.........

So just go with the flow....

If they say they will give GC tomorrow, i am ready to give finger prints daily also

I think its views like this which have made GC and Citizenship such seemingly precious commodities that the grantors of such privileges (USCIS/ DHS etc) have come to believe that they can do whatever they want (delays/ arbitrary rules etc) and still there will be enough willing applicants in line for them to choose from to grant these "precious" privileges.........

I have had a GC now for 2 years - i dont think its made any material change in my life....i still work for the same company i used to before i got GC.........i was never discriminated against in the workplace prior to GC so nothing changed post GC either........the only advantage to me has been that I can visit Canada (which i have to often for business) without a visa.........

Sayantan76,
Of course there is no 'discrimination' (in the true sense of the word) in the workplace if you have a GC or if you don't. It would be silly if that were the case.

But there are a lot of other factors that go towards making the GC so important for some people, myself included.

I have lived in this country long enough to have all kinds of ties/investments here - emotional, financial, real estate, friends, family, etc. which has made not living here almost not a choice anymore.

Given that, the fact that I can live here only as long as I have my current job, (and sometimes even if I have my job - other reasons such as wrongful RFEs, denials, etc. throw a wrench in the process) unless I have a GC, makes it so 'precious'.

That being said, I have to respectfully disagree with you. You have been fortunate to get your GC in such a short time (and I am happy for you), but trust me, it is when you cross that, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 year mark waiting for your GC when these things start to get to you.

Of course, I am with you when you say that the extremely high demand for a GC shouldn't allow the powers that be, to take undue advantage of the situation, but it still doesn't mean that for some people (or maybe even a lot of people) getting the GC is indeed a huge deal.

Like GCdreamer05, I too, would have no problem getting fingerprinted as many times as reasonably feasible, if that meant getting my GC rightaway.

Godspeed to all of us.

dealsnet
03-23-2009, 11:01 AM
They took my fingerprint and photo on my arrival from India 3 weeks back. It was at JFK airport. I didn't ask why. I put the fingers, they didn't satisfied and took another set of finger prints.!!!
It was my first return to US after getting the greencard last year July. Even after getting GC, I felt like in H1B.

chanduv23
03-23-2009, 11:54 AM
They took my fingerprint and photo on my arrival from India 3 weeks back. It was at JFK airport. I didn't ask why. I put the fingers, they didn't satisfied and took another set of finger prints.!!!
It was my first return to US after getting the greencard last year July. Even after getting GC, I felt like in H1B.

Hmmm - what do you all think is the purpose of fingerprinting LPRs?

gcdreamer05
03-23-2009, 11:59 AM
Hmmm - what do you all think is the purpose of fingerprinting LPRs?

Any idea why this post is coming in red color font on the home page, i was under the impression that only posts which IV wants everyone to notice like the FOIA funding drive come in red color, but why is this post coming in red color on the homepage, is it a bug or am i seeing it different on my pc ?

Green.Tech
03-23-2009, 12:07 PM
Any idea why this post is coming in red color font on the home page, i was under the impression that only posts which IV wants everyone to notice like the FOIA funding drive come in red color, but why is this post coming in red color on the homepage, is it a bug or am i seeing it different on my pc ?

It does show up in red color; so, it's not your pc.

drak70
03-23-2009, 12:27 PM
Went to india 2 days after getting GC and returned (with temporary I-551 stamp) via EWR newark

I stood in US citizen/LPR line
They asked me to take fingerprints on electronic scanner just like the credit card scanner you see at the grocery store. You put all the 4 finger together ,then thumb separately repeat it for other hand then take you snap. It took less than 2 min

for my wife they just took one single scan of one hand,when I asked the POE CBP office why? he said thats all the system asked to take.

My take is we still owe allegiance to a foreign passport so we should not be too touchy about extra security arrangement like FP scans

pappu
03-23-2009, 12:56 PM
Originally Posted by gcdreamer05
Just be patient and allow them to do watever they want, finger print, leg print, mouth print or any print..... all they can do is just for 5 years after that you are citizen then whatever applies to otehrs apply for you.........

So just go with the flow....

If they say they will give GC tomorrow, i am ready to give finger prints daily also

I think its views like this which have made GC and Citizenship such seemingly precious commodities that the grantors of such privileges (USCIS/ DHS etc) have come to believe that they can do whatever they want (delays/ arbitrary rules etc) and still there will be enough willing applicants in line for them to choose from to grant these "precious" privileges.........

I have had a GC now for 2 years - i dont think its made any material change in my life....i still work for the same company i used to before i got GC.........i was never discriminated against in the workplace prior to GC so nothing changed post GC either........the only advantage to me has been that I can visit Canada (which i have to often for business) without a visa.........
If a person has to wait for several years the story can be different.

We all want that greencards be given without much wait, (like in your your case) so that people can focus on their profession and personal lives and live it better. While it may not bring any material change, as you still need to do a job and bring food to the table, it certainly gives some peace of mind and the ability to explore and try new possibilities in career. H1 and L1s are very prohibitive and the temporary nature of the visa makes a person feel very uncertain, fearful and tied.

pappu
03-23-2009, 01:06 PM
Any idea why this post is coming in red color font on the home page, i was under the impression that only posts which IV wants everyone to notice like the FOIA funding drive come in red color, but why is this post coming in red color on the homepage, is it a bug or am i seeing it different on my pc ?

All threads started by Admins/Moderators will show up in red. We have done this so that all action items and important posts are easy to identify.

number30
03-23-2009, 01:20 PM
Went to india 2 days after getting GC and returned (with temporary I-551 stamp) via EWR newark

I stood in US citizen/LPR line
They asked me to take fingerprints on electronic scanner just like the credit card scanner you see at the grocery store. You put all the 4 finger together ,then thumb separately repeat it for other hand then take you snap. It took less than 2 min

for my wife they just took one single scan of one hand,when I asked the POE CBP office why? he said thats all the system asked to take.

My take is we still owe allegiance to a foreign passport so we should not be too touchy about extra security arrangement like FP scans

FP for returning permenent Residents is effective from Jan-18 of this year.

wahwah
03-23-2009, 02:10 PM
did you wait in the US citizens/LPR line or were you directed to the Visitors line at JFK POE?


They took my fingerprint and photo on my arrival from India 3 weeks back. It was at JFK airport. I didn't ask why. I put the fingers, they didn't satisfied and took another set of finger prints.!!!
It was my first return to US after getting the greencard last year July. Even after getting GC, I felt like in H1B.

dealsnet
03-23-2009, 04:03 PM
I did stand on LPR line. For citizens, a separate line. One guy announced, 'people with small plastic card stand on that line.'
The person took finger print, photograph and also asked me what is my profession and what I am doing. Enquired about my visit. I told him that I did visit my relatives. It is a 2 week visit. One guy before me (look like middle east) came with me by Kuwait Airways, they interviewd him for 5 minutes and they took him inside for another inspection/interview. I did overheard saying he is going to Chicago. He is also a GC holder around 50 years old.
I am surprised, usually these questions asked for H1B people. I thought no questions for GC people.

did you wait in the US citizens/LPR line or were you directed to the Visitors line at JFK POE?

wahwah
03-23-2009, 05:31 PM
i think in the long term, there will be 3 queues now - one for US citizens, one for LPR's and one for visitors.
this probably hasn't been implemented at all the POE's so i guess they're asking the LPR's to join the visitor's line.


I did stand on LPR line. For citizens, a separate line. One guy announced, 'people with small plastic card stand on that line.'
The person took finger print, photograph and also asked me what is my profession and what I am doing. Enquired about my visit. I told him that I did visit my relatives. It is a 2 week visit. One guy before me (look like middle east) came with me by Kuwait Airways, they interviewd him for 5 minutes and they took him inside for another inspection/interview. I did overheard saying he is going to Chicago. He is also a GC holder around 50 years old.
I am surprised, usually these questions asked for H1B people. I thought no questions for GC people.