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ssreenu
04-13-2011, 03:04 PM
Can we propose a bill which would give us - the honest, sincere, law abiding aliens - a time bound path to Green Card and Citizenship?

Political parties only talk and seem to be interested in giving illegals a time bound path to citizenship? They even introduced a "Dream Act" in favour their children. Why should we / our children be sidelined?

Can we request for a bill which would:

1.Grant GC to all EB 2 / 3 class pimary applicants who have completed 8 years of continuous stay in the USA without any criminal record.

2. Provide Citizeship to all EB primary applicants who have completed 12 years of continuous stay without any criminal record

Note:

When the primary applicant is issued a GC / Citizenship, the dependents (spouse and kids) should get the same benefit.

The current system is designed to favour ONLY the employers and the law firms, not the humble, hard working EB class slave who toils.

ssreenu
04-13-2011, 03:05 PM
This is for you Mr. Goodintentions, we need to start somewhere so here we start.:)

mayurcreation
04-13-2011, 03:12 PM
It is good idea. And ofcourse better than visa number, EB1/EB2/EB3 and all other crap. Countries like UK, Canada, etc. have similar kind of immigration policies.

waitingnwaiting
04-13-2011, 03:27 PM
The idea is interesting, but I am not convinced. I am a skeptic. Becacuse the question is how will anyone be able to make this idea into reality. Someone should manage a timeplan, budget for this bill. We also need few people to go to Capitol and talk to media and Senators. We need someone to become a leader of this idea. Without a leader and timeplan I cannot buy this idea.

Questions to the person who started this thread:

1. Can you also post the draft of this bill or a document explaining this bill.
2. What is the timeline and budget to push this bill?
3. What is your plan to push it.

Question to whoever says they agree with the idea
1. Post your contribution to this bill if you support it. Basically say what you would do to support it.
There should be a timeplan made and everyone that has pledged would then be asked to do their bit.

ghost
04-13-2011, 03:33 PM
Can we propose a bill which would give us - the honest, sincere, law abiding aliens - a time bound path to Green Card and Citizenship?



If you are serious about your proposal - please reach out to IV core and ask them provide the necessary guidance to take up this effort.

FYI - it's not easy to propose a bill but Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-Alabama) is your best bet. As much as you can lobby with his legislative office, you'll gain traction on your proposal. Good Luck!

ssreenu
04-13-2011, 03:38 PM
The idea is interesting, but I am not convinced. I am a skeptic. Becacuse the question is how will anyone be able to make this idea into reality. Someone should manage a timeplan, budget for this bill. We also need few people to go to Capitol and talk to media and Senators. We need someone to become a leader of this idea. Without a leader and timeplan I cannot buy this idea.

Questions to the person who started this thread:

1. Can you also post the draft of this bill or a document explaining this bill.
2. What is the timeline and budget to push this bill?
3. What is your plan to push it.

Question to whoever says they agree with the idea
1. Post your contribution to this bill if you support it. Basically say what you would do to support it.
There should be a timeplan made and everyone that has pledged would then be asked to do their bit.

I agree, these were not my ideas but it was reasonable enough to motivate me to start this thread. Every one who concurs with these ideas should contribute to this bill. I am still a newbie to this forum and trying to understand how to's...

ssreenu
04-13-2011, 03:40 PM
If you are serious about your proposal - please reach out to IV core and ask them provide the necessary guidance to take up this effort.

FYI - it's not easy to propose a bill but Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-Alabama) is your best bet. As much as you can lobby with his legislative office, you'll gain traction on your proposal. Good Luck!

How do I reach out to the IV core? :confused:

ghost
04-13-2011, 04:01 PM
How do I reach out to the IV core? :confused:

That's easy...go to "Advocacy" tab on the home page and click on "Core Team".

bugsbunny
04-13-2011, 04:27 PM
Can we request for a bill which would:

1.Grant GC to all EB 2 / 3 class pimary applicants who have completed 8 years of continuous stay in the USA without any criminal record.

2. Provide Citizeship to all EB primary applicants who have completed 12 years of continuous stay without any criminal record


For 1. Lets aim for 5 years wait and then GC for all...since lawmakers keep using a 5 years wait timeline for various such bills they themselves propose

I don't think point 2 is needed...as the requirements for citizenship are different from GC and also may not be what everyone wants.

goel_ar
04-13-2011, 04:39 PM
Can we propose a bill which
No offense - but it seems you are proposing like you are a congressman.. said & done..

Goodintentions
04-13-2011, 07:06 PM
Can we propose a bill which would give us - the honest, sincere, law abiding aliens - a time bound path to Green Card and Citizenship?

Political parties only talk and seem to be interested in giving illegals a time bound path to citizenship? They even introduced a "Dream Act" in favour their children. Why should we / our children be sidelined?

Can we request for a bill which would:

1.Grant GC to all EB 2 / 3 class pimary applicants who have completed 8 years of continuous stay in the USA without any criminal record.

2. Provide Citizeship to all EB primary applicants who have completed 12 years of continuous stay without any criminal record

Note:

When the primary applicant is issued a GC / Citizenship, the dependents (spouse and kids) should get the same benefit.

The current system is designed to favour ONLY the employers and the law firms, not the humble, hard working EB class slave who toils.
==========

I never expected that you will be kind enough to reproduce my text verbatim from my posting in the "Predictions Part II" thread"

Here is what I want to add:

1. Time bound path simplifies several redundant and "non-value add' activities

2. The alien immigrant starts investing within the USA, plans to buy a home etc as he is sure that he will become a respectable citizen in 12 years

3. This system is followed in several EU countries and UK and even Australia and Singapore. This is not ssomething new. It is a time tested program

4. It also helps the immigrant to decide his plan of action. For example, if he feels he cannot wait for 8 years, he has the option to plan his exit out of the USA (and go to his home country or whatever)

5. The employers / lawyers cannot perpetually arm twist, harass and exploit the immigrant by blackmailing him with the threat of withdrawing the I 140, for example

6. This guarantees individual liberty which is supposed to be "pillar stone" of the US Constitution

From our side -

1. It will forge unity (no more EB2 / EB3 fights)

2. Encourage active participation by all EB friends

So far -

1. In terms of policy / rule the only fix that has happened in all these years seems to be AC21 (However, even with EAD it appears that shifting jobs is not easy! This has been discussed at length in the AC 21 thread)

2. We have otherwise been able to achieve very minor admin fixes after years of toil

3. Under the existing framework we will continue to be grouped with the illegals who will never allow us to come of this mess. They may be illegal, but have the lobby power, money powe, muscle power and vote power.

4. CIR will never see the light of the day, because of political compulsions.

5. Day in and day out we are trying for Visa recapture, but we have not succeeded because of the unfortunate inherent EB2 / EB3 split within our ranks (and others enjoy the fun and benefit from it)

I feel that this approach will filter the legals from the illegals and a I hope that several right thinking law makers would support us.


Worth the try, friends!

Thanks everyone!!!

ssreenu
04-14-2011, 08:50 AM
From the following information:

1.Grant GC to all EB 2 / 3 class pimary applicants who have completed 8 years of continuous stay in the USA without any criminal record.

Personally, I do think the above bill you requested in the #1) is extremely difficult to work. It is because there was a bill proposed to the EB-2/EB-3 applicants to occupy the annual DV-lottery of 55,000 quota but it is NOT becomed a law yet. Now is April, 2011 and the DV-lottery results of this year will be announced soon online and the coming year of DV-lottery will be drawn again later during this coming Oct, 2011 but there is still NO hope to give those EB-2/EB-3 applicants into this DV-lottery quota. If this quota is occupied by EB-2/EB-3 applicants, less applicants will be in GC line.

Also, there is a proposed bill to allow foreign US accreditated universities' advanced graduates of STEM and with a US job offer to have GC but again it is NOT becomed a law yet. Also, your proposed EB-2/EB-3 applicants who have continuous stay of 8 years in US without criminal record to have GC may not fit the requirement of US needed because some of these EB-2/EB-3 applicants are NOT graduated in US universities and some of them are NOT in Science, Medicine, Engineering and Techology academic major which US society in demand.

Last time I have read some other online news or forum, it talks about there is guy who was graduated in a US university with double Master degree---one is M.Sc in computer science and the other is MBA and he still get stuck in getting his first new H-1B visa and later he decided to back home without choice. Yesterday I have read some other online news or forum, it talks about some people who graduated in US Ph.D or doctorate degree in Science/Engineering/Medicine cannot get the GC or some of them get stuck in his or her first new H-1B visa application (due to quota was full or from other reasons) or get stuck in the H-1B visa renewed. So without H-1B visa, how can they get into the EB line for GC?----They are all US graduates and have stayed in US for more than 6-8 years to study with social security card and drivers' licenses and without criminal record !!!!!!!!!!!!!

So you can see if your requested bill in #1) is working, so how about those who graduated in US university in Advanced degree of Science/Medicine/Engineering with US job offer or without H-1B visa?------They are US STEM graduates and have stayed in US with 6-8 years either study or work without criminal record (and with social security card and drivers' licenses)

Personally, I do believe since US demand Science/Medicine/Engineering (STEM) type people and also need the inflow of money to rescue the national debt, so why don't allow those US STEM type graduates get the GC and bring the money to immigrate to start up companies to create job opportunities and to buy houses. Then the non-STEM graduates who want to stay in US can also go into the second path of immigration such as bring money to set up companies to hire 3-6 persons for better economy. The DV-lottery can open to any US STEM graduates to enrol online by " first come, first get" basis and if once annual immigration quota of 55,000 is filled, those graduates need to wait for another year to enrol online for immigration. So every STEM or non-STEM graduates bring money to start companies in US creating job opportunities, paying taxes and bring inflow of money----better economy is growing up.

Moreover, those graduates will invite friends/relatives to visit US, increasing sales of both international and dosmetic airline tickets, hotel reservations, restaurant reservations and uplift the profits all kinds of retail businesses. Tourist visa fees will also add monetary income. Overall, inflow of money and jobs creation are dual powers to uplift the economy.
With inflow of money from immigration, there is NO government shutdown and there is NO hiking taxes needed for the existing US companies.

Also, in Australia, it allows foreign graduates who have stayed in Australia for over 5 years and without criminal record to get the GC automatically


OK first of all this proposed bill has no relation to the DV lottery neither does it have any relation to H1B visa. We are talking about the people who are stuck in GC queue for 8 years or more. Which means we are referring to people you started their GC application 8 years ago and still waiting in queue without knowing when their number will come. I hope this clarifies your doubts. Just because you stayed legally for 8 years does not/should not qualify you for getting permanent residency, you have been legally here and paying taxes for the past 8 years there by contributing to the economic growth of the country and this should be the reason why the US govt should consider you for giving you permanent residency. Think about the kids of EB3 holders who are on H4 and want to join college after 16 years, They are not considered residents in US and there by all the international rules apply for their college studies. So much for being in US for 8 years or more and paying taxes to the government and contributing to the economic growth and you get to pay more and more. When illegals can get a DREAM ACT why not our kids? if you are married recently and had your kid born here in the US you might not understand this because your kid is a US citizen but it has a huge impact on EB category members whose kids are not born in the USA, just think about them.

One has to start somewhere to achieve their goals without even trying to start how can we think this is not possible. I don't want to give any examples here but I would like to say that out motive should be to turn the IMPOSSIBLE to I'M POSSIBLE. Those who are with me please contribute. Critics are welcome without them we would never get new ideas for discussions.

Wishing for the betterment of everyone in this forum!

ssreenu
04-14-2011, 09:26 AM
Bump

psagarn
04-14-2011, 12:23 PM
Can we rope in organizations like those mentioned in the subject line for our cause?

Single most important reason I have not bought a house yet is that I do not have a GC and thus can be kicked out anytime. Most of my savings have been invested in Real Estate in India not because I think investment there is more profitable but because I do not have confidence that I will get GC here for sure. All of my friends who own a house waited till they got GC and those who do not own one, are those waiting for GC. In short, more GCs to Desis generally would mean increased housing demand, at least that is what the initial look at numbers indicate. Thoughts?

PlainSpeak
04-14-2011, 12:39 PM
From the following information:

1.Grant GC to all EB 2 / 3 class pimary applicants who have completed 8 years of continuous stay in the USA without any criminal record.

Personally, I do think the above bill you requested in the #1) is extremely difficult to work. It is because there was a bill proposed to the EB-2/EB-3 applicants to occupy the annual DV-lottery of 55,000 quota but it is NOT becomed a law yet. Now is April, 2011 and the DV-lottery results of this year will be announced soon online and the coming year of DV-lottery will be drawn again later during this coming Oct, 2011 but there is still NO hope to give those EB-2/EB-3 applicants into this DV-lottery quota. If this quota is occupied by EB-2/EB-3 applicants, less applicants will be in GC line.

Also, there is a proposed bill to allow foreign US accreditated universities' advanced graduates of STEM and with a US job offer to have GC but again it is NOT becomed a law yet. Also, your proposed EB-2/EB-3 applicants who have continuous stay of 8 years in US without criminal record to have GC may not fit the requirement of US needed because some of these EB-2/EB-3 applicants are NOT graduated in US universities and some of them are NOT in Science, Medicine, Engineering and Techology academic major which US society in demand.

Last time I have read some other online news or forum, it talks about there is guy who was graduated in a US university with double Master degree---one is M.Sc in computer science and the other is MBA and he still get stuck in getting his first new H-1B visa and later he decided to back home without choice. Yesterday I have read some other online news or forum, it talks about some people who graduated in US Ph.D or doctorate degree in Science/Engineering/Medicine cannot get the GC or some of them get stuck in his or her first new H-1B visa application (due to quota was full or from other reasons) or get stuck in the H-1B visa renewed. So without H-1B visa, how can they get into the EB line for GC?----They are all US graduates and have stayed in US for more than 6-8 years to study with social security card and drivers' licenses and without criminal record !!!!!!!!!!!!!

So you can see if your requested bill in #1) is working, so how about those who graduated in US university in Advanced degree of Science/Medicine/Engineering with US job offer or without H-1B visa?------They are US STEM graduates and have stayed in US with 6-8 years either study or work without criminal record (and with social security card and drivers' licenses)

Personally, I do believe since US demand Science/Medicine/Engineering (STEM) type people and also need the inflow of money to rescue the national debt, so why don't allow those US STEM type graduates get the GC and bring the money to immigrate to start up companies to create job opportunities and to buy houses. Then the non-STEM graduates who want to stay in US can also go into the second path of immigration such as bring money to set up companies to hire 3-6 persons for better economy. The DV-lottery can open to any US STEM graduates to enrol online by " first come, first get" basis and if once annual immigration quota of 55,000 is filled, those graduates need to wait for another year to enrol online for immigration. So every STEM or non-STEM graduates bring money to start companies in US creating job opportunities, paying taxes and bring inflow of money----better economy is growing up.

Moreover, those graduates will invite friends/relatives to visit US, increasing sales of both international and dosmetic airline tickets, hotel reservations, restaurant reservations and uplift the profits all kinds of retail businesses. Tourist visa fees will also add monetary income. Overall, inflow of money and jobs creation are dual powers to uplift the economy.
With inflow of money from immigration, there is NO government shutdown and there is NO hiking taxes needed for the existing US companies.

Also, in Australia, it allows foreign graduates who have stayed in Australia for over 5 years and without criminal record to get the GC automatically

One correction to all that was stated above....

Instead of allowing US STEM graduates to get GC based on US job offer it would be beneficial to instead allow US STEM graduates to apply and get H1B without any quota. Tht way they will get into the system and don't need to go back to home country. Giving GC to STEM graduates directly is wrong by law because it bypasses labour and 140 conditions which state that a company is willing to sponser GC for a person.

PlainSpeak
04-14-2011, 12:40 PM
Instead of allowing US STEM graduates to get GC based on US job offer it would be beneficial to instead allow US STEM graduates to apply and get H1B without any quota. Tht way they will get into the system and don't need to go back to home country. Giving GC to STEM graduates directly is wrong by law because it bypasses labour and 140 conditions which state that a company is willing to sponser GC for a person based on current market conditions.

ssreenu
04-14-2011, 01:00 PM
Can we rope in organizations like those mentioned in the subject line for our cause?

Single most important reason I have not bought a house yet is that I do not have a GC and thus can be kicked out anytime. Most of my savings have been invested in Real Estate in India not because I think investment there is more profitable but because I do not have confidence that I will get GC here for sure. All of my friends who own a house waited till they got GC and those who do not own one, are those waiting for GC. In short, more GCs to Desis generally would mean increased housing demand, at least that is what the initial look at numbers indicate. Thoughts?

I am in the same boat, I have seen many people who are also in the same situation. I don't like investing here at all for the very fact that my future is uncertain.

Goodintentions
04-14-2011, 01:02 PM
The aim of this appeal is not to compare or compete with EB1, PhDs, US MS degree holders or discuss other exotic bills!

There are several hundred EB2 / EB3 folks who have continued to live here for several years (many have crossed 10 years). They are stuck in the infinitely long GC line, for no fault of theirs. It is natural that people who have stayed for long have grown up children (who are not US born) and who need to go to a good college for a good future.

It is almost impossible to pay international fees and it is neither fair no appropriate to break the back of genuine law abiding residents, despite the fact that they have lived for
8 / 10 years and have sincerely paid the taxes due to the government, just because they do not have a GC.

For the "sin" of being Indian/ Chinese born and for the "sin" of not being able to get the GC because the rules favour long term indentured labour, an entire upcoming yonger generation should not be allowed to suffer. This is unfair and discriminatory. If any one of us had been from a country other than India and China, we would have obtained out GCs in 3 / 4 years.

The idea is to have the cases of all genuine, hard working, EB2 / EB3 employees who have honestly lived here and are continuing to process the path ot GC legally, be considered from the human angle, more so from the point of view of the education of the children.

When it comes to illegals, people scream about human values, humanitarian considerations, education of their children, family ties etc etc. What about us, who have followed the rules "to the T" ????

Is following the rules, going through the approval complex web of approval processes, paying taxes and trying to lead sedate and simple lives a sin?

Are we not human beings? May be we are labelled "aliens" but we are certainly not from Mars!

So friends, let us be clear in where we stand and what we are pleading for.

Unless we have the conviction and clarity we cannot make any progess!

Long live the unity of EB 2 / EB3 employees!

May the SUPREME POWER bless IV and the genuine forum members!

ssreenu
04-14-2011, 01:26 PM
Can we rope in organizations like those mentioned in the subject line for our cause?



What exactly do you mean to do? Throw in your ideas and nothing will be spared...

GCVivek
04-14-2011, 01:44 PM
Looks like this idea has come out of mere frustration. Do you know how many people want to immigrate to the USA? Do you know how many people are waiting in line? Do you think it is correct that only EB-immigrants should be given preference? Why because USA needs all of them? While I have used "you" in the previous sentences, I don't mean just you....rather "we".
If you have time-bound path to immigration, then right now, the whole Federal Govt. and all employees will have to work only on getting the immigration files cleared. Under current circumstances, I think the current system will get you a GC faster than if they switched to "time bound" today. Do you realize, how many people will suddenly be suing the Govt. for delays? There is no country which guarantees time-bound path to PR.
While I forcefully oppose the DREAM ACT and CIR, these did not give time bound GCs but only allowed illegals to convert to legals and in time APPLY for GC if they become eligible.


Can we propose a bill which would give us - the honest, sincere, law abiding aliens - a time bound path to Green Card and Citizenship?

Political parties only talk and seem to be interested in giving illegals a time bound path to citizenship? They even introduced a "Dream Act" in favour their children. Why should we / our children be sidelined?

Can we request for a bill which would:

1.Grant GC to all EB 2 / 3 class pimary applicants who have completed 8 years of continuous stay in the USA without any criminal record.

2. Provide Citizeship to all EB primary applicants who have completed 12 years of continuous stay without any criminal record

Note:

When the primary applicant is issued a GC / Citizenship, the dependents (spouse and kids) should get the same benefit.

The current system is designed to favour ONLY the employers and the law firms, not the humble, hard working EB class slave who toils.

GCVivek
04-14-2011, 01:50 PM
It is unfair to say that many EB3 and EB2 folks are stuck in GC queue for more than 10 years, FOR NO FAULT OF THEIRS. Yes, they are stuck but there is fault, in most cases, they knew they were risking it by changing employers for petty raises or other reason. If they followed the original H1B rule and stayed with sponsoring employer, GC for EB3 took a max of 7 years even with the old system of RIR (not PERM) or even without RIR - and that is MAX....very rare.

The aim of this appeal is not to compare or compete with EB1, PhDs, US MS degree holders or discuss other exotic bills!

There are several hundred EB2 / EB3 folks who have continued to live here for several years (many have crossed 10 years). They are stuck in the infinitely long GC line, for no fault of theirs. It is natural that people who have stayed for long have grown up children (who are not US born) and who need to go to a good college for a good future.

It is almost impossible to pay international fees and it is neither fair no appropriate to break the back of genuine law abiding residents, despite the fact that they have lived for
8 / 10 years and have sincerely paid the taxes due to the government, just because they do not have a GC.

For the "sin" of being Indian/ Chinese born and for the "sin" of not being able to get the GC because the rules favour long term indentured labour, an entire upcoming yonger generation should not be allowed to suffer. This is unfair and discriminatory. If any one of us had been from a country other than India and China, we would have obtained out GCs in 3 / 4 years.

The idea is to have the cases of all genuine, hard working, EB2 / EB3 employees who have honestly lived here and are continuing to process the path ot GC legally, be considered from the human angle, more so from the point of view of the education of the children.

When it comes to illegals, people scream about human values, humanitarian considerations, education of their children, family ties etc etc. What about us, who have followed the rules "to the T" ????

Is following the rules, going through the approval complex web of approval processes, paying taxes and trying to lead sedate and simple lives a sin?

Are we not human beings? May be we are labelled "aliens" but we are certainly not from Mars!

So friends, let us be clear in where we stand and what we are pleading for.

Unless we have the conviction and clarity we cannot make any progess!

Long live the unity of EB 2 / EB3 employees!

May the SUPREME POWER bless IV and the genuine forum members!

ssreenu
04-14-2011, 01:59 PM
The aim of this appeal is not to compare or compete with EB1, PhDs, US MS degree holders or discuss other exotic bills!

There are several hundred EB2 / EB3 folks who have continued to live here for several years (many have crossed 10 years). They are stuck in the infinitely long GC line, for no fault of theirs. It is natural that people who have stayed for long have grown up children (who are not US born) and who need to go to a good college for a good future.

It is almost impossible to pay international fees and it is neither fair no appropriate to break the back of genuine law abiding residents, despite the fact that they have lived for
8 / 10 years and have sincerely paid the taxes due to the government, just because they do not have a GC.

For the "sin" of being Indian/ Chinese born and for the "sin" of not being able to get the GC because the rules favour long term indentured labour, an entire upcoming yonger generation should not be allowed to suffer. This is unfair and discriminatory. If any one of us had been from a country other than India and China, we would have obtained out GCs in 3 / 4 years.

The idea is to have the cases of all genuine, hard working, EB2 / EB3 employees who have honestly lived here and are continuing to process the path ot GC legally, be considered from the human angle, more so from the point of view of the education of the children.

When it comes to illegals, people scream about human values, humanitarian considerations, education of their children, family ties etc etc. What about us, who have followed the rules "to the T" ????

Is following the rules, going through the approval complex web of approval processes, paying taxes and trying to lead sedate and simple lives a sin?

Are we not human beings? May be we are labelled "aliens" but we are certainly not from Mars!

So friends, let us be clear in where we stand and what we are pleading for.

Unless we have the conviction and clarity we cannot make any progess!

Long live the unity of EB 2 / EB3 employees!

May the SUPREME POWER bless IV and the genuine forum members!

I modified your post a little bit and I sent an email to white house, I am not sure how far it will go but I would encourage everyone to send an email to whitehouse, they might look into at least one of the emails if not all:

Contact the White House | The White House (http://www.whitehouse.gov/contact)

There are several thousand employment based greecard applicants who have continued to live in the USA for several years (many have crossed even 10 years). They are stuck in the infinitely long greencard line for no fault of theirs. It is natural that people who have stayed for long have grown up children (who are not US born) and who need to go to a good college for a good future. It is almost impossible to pay international fees and it is neither fair no appropriate to break the back of genuine law abiding residents, despite the fact that they have lived for 8 / 10 years and have sincerely paid the taxes to the US government, just because they do not have a Greencard. For the "sin" of being Indian/ Chinese born and for the "sin" of not being able to get the GC because the rules favour long term indentured labour, an entire upcoming yonger generation should not be allowed to suffer. This is unfair and discriminatory. If any one of us had been from a country other than India and China, we would have obtained our greencards in 3 / 4 years. The idea is to have the cases of all genuine, hard working, EB2 / EB3 applicants who have honestly lived here and are continuing to process the path ot GC legally, be considered from the human angle, more so from the point of view of the education of the children.
When it comes to illegals, people scream about human values, humanitarian considerations, education of their children, family ties etc etc. What about us, who have followed the rules?

Is following immigration rules, going through the complex web of approval processes, paying taxes and trying to lead sedate and simple lives a sin?

Are we not human beings? May be we are labelled "aliens" but we are certainly not from Mars! Please consider to clear the long waiting backlogs of the greencard process.

ssreenu
04-14-2011, 02:18 PM
It is unfair to say that many EB3 and EB2 folks are stuck in GC queue for more than 10 years, FOR NO FAULT OF THEIRS. Yes, they are stuck but there is fault, in most cases, they knew they were risking it by changing employers for petty raises or other reason. If they followed the original H1B rule and stayed with sponsoring employer, GC for EB3 took a max of 7 years even with the old system of RIR (not PERM) or even without RIR - and that is MAX....very rare.

If your statements are true why are the dates backloged and EB3 stuck at April 2002? Employment based greencards should be given preference than others for several reasons:

1. Getting into US legally
2. Living legally
3. Got into US on invitation by the employer (I am talking about the most genuine cases)
4. Intention was dual (to work in US and there by immigrate)
5. Generating revenue to the govt by paying taxes

If the employers have not offered to apply for permanent residency people would have not had any intentions of staying back in US and to buy houses. They would have worked for allocated period of time and have gone back to home country like they do in most of the European countries.

belmontboy
04-14-2011, 02:26 PM
Instead of allowing US STEM graduates to get GC based on US job offer it would be beneficial to instead allow US STEM graduates to apply and get H1B without any quota. Tht way they will get into the system and don't need to go back to home country. Giving GC to STEM graduates directly is wrong by law because it bypasses labour and 140 conditions which state that a company is willing to sponser GC for a person based on current market conditions.

Its already there. 20000 for masters and phd students.

Giving GC to stem is to bypass them from EB based line, which means they won't consume numbers from 140k. Isn't this good?

bikram_das_in
04-14-2011, 02:46 PM
This is a good idea. The truth is - to support a bill, you need hundreds of thousands of dollars and few million people supporting it. The agenda IV has, if couple of them get Washington's nod, we will all get GCs. The problem is getting them into congress and eventually getting it passed.


Can we propose a bill which would give us - the honest, sincere, law abiding aliens - a time bound path to Green Card and Citizenship?

................

The current system is designed to favour ONLY the employers and the law firms, not the humble, hard working EB class slave who toils.

new2gc
04-14-2011, 02:47 PM
Are we not human beings? May be we are labelled "aliens" but we are certainly not from Mars! Please consider to clear the long waiting backlogs of the greencard process.

no way.. we are NOT humans...

To the corporates, we are high-skilled slaves with no certainity on the status...easy to say..why bother..go back to your country...:o but the reality is different for each person.

To the govt, we are the funding means...(recent H1B/L1 fees ).

To CIS -- our fees is the main source of income to run the shop..

To Illegals -- we (backlogged EB) are hostages to get their wish fulfilled if any...

To Politicians - we are the their subjects in their arguments...

So you think they will listen to you to cut all these cords?? You kidding right.

take it easy....

Goodintentions
04-14-2011, 02:57 PM
Looks like this idea has come out of mere frustration. Do you know how many people want to immigrate to the USA? Do you know how many people are waiting in line? Do you think it is correct that only EB-immigrants should be given preference? Why because USA needs all of them? While I have used "you" in the previous sentences, I don't mean just you....rather "we".
If you have time-bound path to immigration, then right now, the whole Federal Govt. and all employees will have to work only on getting the immigration files cleared. Under current circumstances, I think the current system will get you a GC faster than if they switched to "time bound" today. Do you realize, how many people will suddenly be suing the Govt. for delays? There is no country which guarantees time-bound path to PR.
While I forcefully oppose the DREAM ACT and CIR, these did not give time bound GCs but only allowed illegals to convert to legals and in time APPLY for GC if they become eligible.
================

Thanks for your comments.

I honestly do not understand why you seem to be opposed to this approach to alleviate the sufferings of so mant EB3 (esp) and EB2 friends. Discussion and debate are always good.

Here are a few facts:

1. Most of the advanced countries in the world - UK, Australia, NZ, Switzerland, Singapore and some Scandinavian countries offer a time based path to residency and citizenship for the educated class of people who come through the proper channel to work

2. In Canada, Australia, NZ (there could be other countries, but I am not sure) people can apply for a PR based on their OWN education and experience. They are not held hostage by their employers and harassed for ages. It is happening here because the lobbies are very powerful and are supported financially by the corporations to serve their interests. The system has been craftily designed to ensure long term indentured labour

3. In the entire scheme of things the real beneficiaries are the employers and the law firms

4. The system would be streamlined and the work of the government would become much simpler and faster. This is the way governments works in several western countries who offer a time bound programme

5. Every month our EB friends need not stare at the bulletin with great expectations and waste their time

6.Everyone can plan their future better. (I do not think I need to explain this)

Best wishes and thanks for your post..

getgreensoon1
04-14-2011, 03:00 PM
It is good idea. And ofcourse better than visa number, EB1/EB2/EB3 and all other crap. Countries like UK, Canada, etc. have similar kind of immigration policies.

Even after having such a relaxed immigration rules, only leftovers go to Canada, UK and Australia.

Goodintentions
04-14-2011, 03:50 PM
Looks like this idea has come out of mere frustration. Do you know how many people want to immigrate to the USA? Do you know how many people are waiting in line? Do you think it is correct that only EB-immigrants should be given preference? Why because USA needs all of them? While I have used "you" in the previous sentences, I don't mean just you....rather "we".
If you have time-bound path to immigration, then right now, the whole Federal Govt. and all employees will have to work only on getting the immigration files cleared. Under current circumstances, I think the current system will get you a GC faster than if they switched to "time bound" today. Do you realize, how many people will suddenly be suing the Govt. for delays? There is no country which guarantees time-bound path to PR.
While I forcefully oppose the DREAM ACT and CIR, these did not give time bound GCs but only allowed illegals to convert to legals and in time APPLY for GC if they become eligible.
================

Thanks for your comments.

I honestly do not understand why you seem to be opposed to this approach to alleviate the sufferings of so mant EB3 (esp) and EB2 friends. Discussion and debate are always good.

Here are a few facts:

1. Most of the advanced countries in the world - UK, Australia, NZ, Switzerland, Singapore and some Scandinavian countries offer a time based path to residency and citizenship for the educated class of people who come through the proper channel to work

2. In Canada, Australia, NZ (there could be other countries, but I am not sure) people can apply for a PR based on their OWN education and experience. They are not held hostage by their employers and harassed for ages. It is happening here because the lobbies are very powerful and are supported financially by the corporations to serve their interests. The system has been craftily designed to ensure long term indentured labour

3. In the entire scheme of things the real beneficiaries are the employers and the law firms

4. The system would be streamlined and the work of the government would become much simpler and faster. This is the way governments works in several western countries who offer a time bound programme

5. Every month our EB friends need not stare at the bulletin with great expectations and waste their time

6.Everyone can plan their future better. (I do not think I need to explain this)

Best wishes and thanks for your post..

Goodintentions
04-14-2011, 04:00 PM
Even after having such a relaxed immigration rules, only leftovers go to Canada, UK and Australia.

======

Your point about left overs is perfectly right, no arguments. Thank you.

However, kindly note that immigrant friendly laws and economic (job) opportunities are different subjects.

People do not want to go to other countries because the job oppportunities are less. Not because the immigration rules are bad :)

People want to come to the USA because job opportunities are better, not because the immigration rules are friendly :)

Here in IV we are purely dicussing immigration. That is our main agenda.

Thank you..

PlainSpeak
04-14-2011, 05:26 PM
Its already there. 20000 for masters and phd students.

Giving GC to stem is to bypass them from EB based line, which means they won't consume numbers from 140k. Isn't this good?

Nope it is not good
Why do STEM graduates have to have it the easy way while we have it hard. The least the STEM graduate can do is wait for 2 years for visa

belmontboy
04-14-2011, 05:28 PM
Nope it is not good
Why do STEM graduates have to have it the easy way while we have it hard. The least the STEM graduate can do is wait for 2 years for visa

Now you are telling the real reason :)

2 yrs wait?? Its been 4 yrs and yet to file 485

Fortunately you are one among the minorities that oppose this proposal. I am glad that IV has this proposal as part of its agenda

Goodintentions
04-14-2011, 05:53 PM
Now you are telling the real reason :)

2 yrs wait?? Its been 4 yrs and yet to file 485

Fortunately you are one among the minorities that oppose this proposal. I am glad that IV has this proposal as part of its agenda
==========

Dear All,

This thread is just an attempt to discuss a time bound GC programme for the suffering EB2 / EB3 folks (especially for EB3).

Kindly note that this has nothing to do with things like Lottery, STEM or anythingelse. They are all irrelevant in this context. This is a simple message. Kindly, let us not digress. This is a humble request.

Simply put --> this thread is ONLY interested in the EB2 / EB3 friends waiting forever

Thanks for the understanding.

GOD bless!

Trust this clarifies...

mmanurker
04-14-2011, 06:41 PM
Can we propose a bill which would give us - the honest, sincere, law abiding aliens - a time bound path to Green Card and Citizenship?

Political parties only talk and seem to be interested in giving illegals a time bound path to citizenship? They even introduced a "Dream Act" in favour their children. Why should we / our children be sidelined?

Can we request for a bill which would:

1.Grant GC to all EB 2 / 3 class pimary applicants who have completed 8 years of continuous stay in the USA without any criminal record.

2. Provide Citizeship to all EB primary applicants who have completed 12 years of continuous stay without any criminal record

Note:

When the primary applicant is issued a GC / Citizenship, the dependents (spouse and kids) should get the same benefit.

The current system is designed to favour ONLY the employers and the law firms, not the humble, hard working EB class slave who toils.

I think we shud first understand the difference between legislation and amending constitution. What you are suggesting requires amending or re-writing part of fourteenth Amendment of constitution to grant citizenship based on the x number of years of legal stay without going through the process of first getting the permanent resident status. And any attempt to amend the constitution is highly unlikely. Similarly the process of getting GC also falls under this category instead in contrast you can fix the issues more justly through legislation/congressional action which is more realistic to fix the broken immigration system like the visa recapture or removing per country quota or allowing someone to file 485 without thier dates being current etc etc., and that is what IV is working on and is more doable. Pappu or someone from IV, pls correct me if I am wrong.

when getting this through mere legislation itself is such a big task with so much of time, resources, money involved for lobbying imagine asking them to amend the constitution is highly unrealistic.

bottom line work with IV and or come up with ideas that can be resolved via legislation instead of repealing 14th amendment of the constitution. Unless someone here thinks that this can be just implemented via legislation then pls enlighten me....

Saralayar
04-15-2011, 10:20 AM
================

Thanks for your comments.

I honestly do not understand why you seem to be opposed to this approach to alleviate the sufferings of so mant EB3 (esp) and EB2 friends. Discussion and debate are always good.

Here are a few facts:

1. Most of the advanced countries in the world - UK, Australia, NZ, Switzerland, Singapore and some Scandinavian countries offer a time based path to residency and citizenship for the educated class of people who come through the proper channel to work

2. In Canada, Australia, NZ (there could be other countries, but I am not sure) people can apply for a PR based on their OWN education and experience. They are not held hostage by their employers and harassed for ages. It is happening here because the lobbies are very powerful and are supported financially by the corporations to serve their interests. The system has been craftily designed to ensure long term indentured labour

3. In the entire scheme of things the real beneficiaries are the employers and the law firms

4. The system would be streamlined and the work of the government would become much simpler and faster. This is the way governments works in several western countries who offer a time bound programme

5. Every month our EB friends need not stare at the bulletin with great expectations and waste their time

6.Everyone can plan their future better. (I do not think I need to explain this)

Best wishes and thanks for your post..
Instead of wasting time and arguing with others, why don't we start a Blog with this theme. You can put all these facts and the way other countries are doing the immigration process for the professionals. This may attract every one including the Government. In the mean time, we can start sending emails to the Congress men also.

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:47 AM
Now you are telling the real reason :)

2 yrs wait?? Its been 4 yrs and yet to file 485

Fortunately you are one among the minorities that oppose this proposal. I am glad that IV has this proposal as part of its agenda

Whether i am a minority and whether i am a majority does not make any difference.

If you want legal speak then ...
Giving GC to STEM graduates is not the right way. If US needs to keep these educated people in US then US needs to make sure these educated people get an H1B without any issues and then they are on the path to GC like everyone else because H1B is a dual intenet visa. Jumping from a F1 visa to a GC visa is not correct as F1 visa is not a immigration intenet visa

If you want plain speak then ...
Why should STEM graduates have it easy when a H1B has to struggle and wait in liner to get a GC.

I would agree to this only is the requirement is made so that only PHD and scientist who have atleats acouple of research papers published be given GC and not every Tom, Dick and harry who completes 4 years engg degree in india from a 2 bit university and whose parents have money and uses this money to pay for 2 years MS.

eastindia
04-15-2011, 10:54 AM
Instead of wasting time and arguing with others, why don't we start a Blog with this theme. You can put all these facts and the way other countries are doing the immigration process for the professionals. This may attract every one including the Government. In the mean time, we can start sending emails to the Congress men also.

After all these posts your plan of action is to start a blog and send emails to Congress. :D

Is that all you can think of? I suggest you educate yourself first on how laws in Congress are changed. Talk to others who were able to change laws in Congress. Then find out how they did it, money they spent, time it took and people it took.

In this country if you want to do anything via congress you have to lobby. Tell me one bill in this country that was passed because someone created a blog and emailed congress.

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 11:35 AM
Whether i am a minority and whether i am a majority does not make any difference.

If you want legal speak then ...
Giving GC to STEM graduates is not the right way. If US needs to keep these educated people in US then US needs to make sure these educated people get an H1B without any issues and then they are on the path to GC like everyone else because H1B is a dual intenet visa. Jumping from a F1 visa to a GC visa is not correct as F1 visa is not a immigration intenet visa

If you want plain speak then ...
Why should STEM graduates have it easy when a H1B has to struggle and wait in liner to get a GC.

I would agree to this only is the requirement is made so that only PHD and scientist who have atleats acouple of research papers published be given GC and not every Tom, Dick and harry who completes 4 years engg degree in india from a 2 bit university and whose parents have money and uses this money to pay for 2 years MS.

People who are going to benefit by this will support this. Others oppose.
I believe you belong to latter.

One thing to remember is this provision helps STEM grads irrespective of their EB-class.

legal speak: right now law does exist. F1 to GC would be illegal. This provision is to make the conversion legal

plain speak: look beyond your own situation. Since you are not going to benefit directly, does not mean you stand against it.

Lastly, everybody's parents don't have so much money like you think. People do get 13% student loans in India to fund their studies.

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 11:47 AM
People who are going to benefit by this will support this. Others oppose.
I believe you belong to latter.

One thing to remember is this provision helps STEM grads irrespective of their EB-class.

legal speak: right now law does exist. F1 to GC would be illegal. This provision is to make the conversion legal

plain speak: look beyond your own situation. Since you are not going to benefit directly, does not mean you stand against it.

Lastly, everybody's parents don't have so much money like you think. People do get 13% student loans in India to fund their studies.

Changing F1 to GC law to make it legal has as much chance as getting law change to not include dependents. I would rather support the latter then support F1 to GC law change

I do look beyond my own situation and thats why i support current spillover rules and filing 485 without current PD issue even though it does not help me directly in any way what soever and if fact is dterimental to my EB3 case.

Can you say the same ? C
Can you support an argument to give 50 k dv visa to badly retrogressed category irrespective of preference category?
Fact is You are the one who cannot see beyond your own selfish needs and you are accusing me of the same thing you are doing

As far as i know the whole MS F1 visa is a big scam and loophole to enter us and stay here when you are not supposed to and that is the loophole that needs to be closed first instesad of worrying about fruad porting and EB1 fraud. Closing thsi student GC loophole will clear up the whole EB retrogression mess

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 12:13 PM
Changing F1 to GC law to make it legal has as much chance as getting law change to not include dependents. I would rather support the latter then support F1 to GC law change

I do look beyond my own situation and thats why i support current spillover rules and filing 485 without current PD issue even though it does not help me directly in any way what soever and if fact is dterimental to my EB3 case.

Can you say the same ? C
Can you support an argument to give 50 k dv visa to badly retrogressed category irrespective of preference category?
Fact is You are the one who cannot see beyond your own selfish needs and you are accusing me of the same thing you are doing

As far as i know the whole MS F1 visa is a big scam and loophole to enter us and stay here when you are not supposed to and that is the loophole that needs to be closed first instesad of worrying about fruad porting and EB1 fraud. Closing thsi student GC loophole will clear up the whole EB retrogression mess

Yes, I support excluding dependents from quota.

If you look at IV's agenda, most of the items benefit EB as a whole. The idea is to reduce number of people being part of quota. If you think in these terms, you should not have any problem in supporting "Exclusion of STEM grads" from regular quota.

I support legal porting of EB3 to EB2 even though its detrimental to my own case. So I am not selfish like you call me :)

As for your stand on MS F1 visa, you remind me of "rkay". He too makes nonsensical statements like you. If there was an violation of law, USCIS would have known it and plugged the loophole. If you have found some "loophole" that USCIS doesnot know, let them know.

Saralayar
04-15-2011, 12:14 PM
After all these posts your plan of action is to start a blog and send emails to Congress. :D

Is that all you can think of? I suggest you educate yourself first on how laws in Congress are changed. Talk to others who were able to change laws in Congress. Then find out how they did it, money they spent, time it took and people it took.

In this country if you want to do anything via congress you have to lobby. Tell me one bill in this country that was passed because someone created a blog and emailed congress.
Before laughing at others why don't you update your profile with your GC filing details??

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 12:18 PM
Plainspeak says.."As far as i know the whole MS F1 visa is a big scam and loophole to enter us and stay here when you are not supposed to and that is the loophole that needs to be closed first instesad of worrying about fruad porting and EB1 fraud. Closing thsi student GC loophole will clear up the whole EB retrogression mess "

F1 is not a scam. its legal visa. once u enter into usa on F1, u can stay here to study. while doing MS, u can also work on CPT legally. after completion of the MS degree, it is legal to stay on OPT and work. recently the US govt has increased the OPT period from 12 to 29 months. again its legal. its legal to apply for H1B while maintaining a proper F1 status or OPT.

People who dont like this.... dont either because they dont understand F1 very well, or just plainly speaking jealous or out of their mind.

i guess we should be happy if someone is making progress legally even if we are not in the same boat.:)

Let us say that i agree to what ever you say. In what way does everything you stated above make a STEM graduate eligible for GC without an Employer sponsership. Why does it have to be only STEM graduates which will not need employer sponsership. If giving GC based on completion of MS in us is bypassing the employee sponserhsip then that has to be extended to all EB categories of immigrants (EB1/EB2/EB3) and the benefit o those visas have to be passed to the badly retrogressed category first.

It si not teh question of liek or unliking or having jealousy. It is the question of law. According to the US law employee sponsership is EB category so any new bill which has to be introduced will have to follow the EB category employee sponsership rule, othwer wise it wil not see the light of the day

Personally i see no chance of this DV lottery STEM billpassing in any shape or form either now or in the future

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 12:19 PM
Yes, I support excluding dependents from quota.

If you look at IV's agenda, most of the items benefit EB as a whole. The idea is to reduce number of people being part of quota. If you think in these terms, you should not have any problem in supporting "Exclusion of STEM grads" from regular quota.

I support legal porting of EB3 to EB2 even though its detrimental to my own case. So I am not selfish like you call me :)

As for your stand on MS F1 visa, you remind me of "rkay". He too makes nonsensical statements like you. If there was an violation of law, USCIS would have known it and plugged the loophole. If you have found some "loophole" that USCIS doesnot know, let them know.

Please see my reply to alien007 for my rebuttal

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 12:39 PM
Let us say that i agree to what ever you say. In what way does everything you stated above make a STEM graduate eligible for GC without an Employer sponsership. Why does it have to be only STEM graduates which will not need employer sponsership. If giving GC based on completion of MS in us is bypassing the employee sponserhsip then that has to be extended to all EB categories of immigrants (EB1/EB2/EB3) and the benefit o those visas have to be passed to the badly retrogressed category first.

Yes, the provision would apply across all EB classes. And if its quota exempted, then it does not matter as every eligible candidate gets his/her turn.

It si not teh question of liek or unliking or having jealousy. It is the question of law. According to the US law employee sponsership is EB category so any new bill which has to be introduced will have to follow the EB category employee sponsership rule, othwer wise it wil not see the light of the day.

Yes, that's what this provision is targeting. Change the law, make STEM grads cap exempt

Personally i see no chance of this DV lottery STEM billpassing in any shape or form either now or in the future

Answers inline

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 01:17 PM
Answers inline

Well IV support to this bill does not have my support.
But IV will do what it has to do.
So i cannot wish you all the best because i disagree with the approach

Let us see how things will pan out

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 01:28 PM
Well IV support to this bill does not have my support.
But IV will do what it has to do.
So i cannot wish you all the best because i disagree with the approach

Let us see how things will pan out

we don't have to agree and support everything. IV does what benefits majority of the people (directly or indirectly)

No worries with the luck, If I was lucky, I would have had my GC by now.

BTW, many thanks for a civilized discussion.

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 01:41 PM
we don't have to agree and support everything. IV does what benefits majority of the people (directly or indirectly)

No worries with the luck, If I was lucky, I would have had my GC by now.

BTW, many thanks for a civilized discussion.

It was always the same from my side.

I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it.
-Voltaire

gk_2000
04-15-2011, 02:43 PM
Do you know why all arguments against F1 to GC are moot? It's because US does NOT view it as misuse. They are talking about not letting the students go, and stapling GC's to certificates. Do you think there will be any result from fighting that sentiment?

This is another rant idea and it is wasting everyone's time. I request all to pls stop bumping this thread on that count

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 07:41 PM
Do you know why all arguments against F1 to GC are moot? It's because US does NOT view it as misuse. They are talking about not letting the students go, and stapling GC's to certificates. Do you think there will be any result from fighting that sentiment?

This is another rant idea and it is wasting everyone's time. I request all to pls stop bumping this thread on that count

If it is not misue why does the embassy reject F1 visa if applicant cannot show proper ties to home country

Talk is cheap, anyone can talk anything. What is current position of DV to STEM visa bill?

Stapling GC to certificates now please don't make me laugh ......

There is no such sentiment what so even and i am not fighting but stating my disagreement with the whole idea that MS student add to the economy. While they a burden to US for 2 years and add nothing to the economy during the same 2, years a H1B contributes to the economy in form of taxes (SS, medicare State and Federal Tax)

Can you refute that ?????

Your turn ...........

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 08:44 PM
While they a burden to US for 2 years and add nothing to the economy during the same 2, years a H1B contributes to the economy in form of taxes (SS, medicare State and Federal Tax)

Can you refute that ?????

Your turn ...........

MS fees are 30k.

Plainspeak: get your facts right before you come for a fight

gk_2000
04-15-2011, 09:08 PM
If it is not misue why does the embassy reject F1 visa if applicant cannot show proper ties to home country

Talk is cheap, anyone can talk anything. What is current position of DV to STEM visa bill?

Stapling GC to certificates now please don't make me laugh ......

There is no such sentiment what so even and i am not fighting but stating my disagreement with the whole idea that MS student add to the economy. While they a burden to US for 2 years and add nothing to the economy during the same 2, years a H1B contributes to the economy in form of taxes (SS, medicare State and Federal Tax)

Can you refute that ?????

Your turn ...........

All I want is for you to recognize, that what your argument may lead to, is that the F1 may be altered to be dual-intent, rather than invalidating the F1 to GC path. It is just a matter of perspective. You must be able to see the matter from other points of view

And let's try to avoid bashing other immigrants. Bring up points that help us all, or at least a majority of us. For example, I have an argument that The below INS law is impossible to implement.

USCIS - I-Link Reference (http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.f6da51a2342135be7e9d7a10e0dc91a0/?vgnextoid=fa7e539dc4bed010VgnVCM1000000ecd190aRCR D&vgnextchannel=fa7e539dc4bed010VgnVCM1000000ecd190a RCRD&CH=act)



INA: ACT 245 - ADJUSTMENT OF STATUS OF NONIMMIGRANT TO THAT OF PERSON ADMITTED FOR PERMANENT RESIDENCE


Sec. 245. [8 U.S.C. 1255]

(a) The status of an alien who was inspected and admitted or paroled into the United States 1/ or the status of any other alien having an approved petition for classification as a VAWA self-petitioner 1aa/ may be adjusted by the Attorney General, in his discretion and under such regulations as he may prescribe, to that of an alien lawfully admitted for permanent residence if


(1) the alien makes an application for such adjustment,


(2) the alien is eligible to receive an immigrant visa and is admissible to the United States for permanent residence, and


(3) an immigrant visa is immediately available to him at the time his application is filed.


It is impossible to carry out #3, because the numbers just aren't there to arrive at a definitive conclusion, that an immigrant visa is available to a person.

What arguments for or against this can you make?

jetflyer
04-15-2011, 09:46 PM
View Post
While they a burden to US for 2 years and add nothing to the economy during the same 2, years a H1B contributes to the economy in form of taxes (SS, medicare State and Federal Tax)

Can you refute that ?????

Your turn ...........

PlainSpeak...F1 are not burden to US, they pay big college fees for the education.

You know who is real burden, thats H4 visa holders like you. who have nothing to do. they just sit home eat and fight.

you are a classic example of burden to the society.. you are spending all the time here and fighting with everyone.

if anyone starts talking about anything, you just come and start fighting.

Jet

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 10:00 PM
PlainSpeak...F1 are not burden to US, they pay big college fees for the education.

You know who is real burden, thats H4 visa holders like you. who have nothing to do. they just sit home eat and fight.

you are a classic example of burden to the society.. you are spending all the time here and fighting with everyone.

if anyone starts talking about anything, you just come and start fighting.

Jet

Lets not denigrate all the H4's. I am sure our near and dear ones aren't vile as PlainSpeak.

Funny post though

gk_2000
04-15-2011, 10:03 PM
Hey belmont Guy and Jet Lee, can you take a crack at my question?

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:04 PM
PlainSpeak...F1 are not burden to US, they pay big college fees for the education.

You know who is real burden, thats H4 visa holders like you. who have nothing to do. they just sit home eat and fight.

you are a classic example of burden to the society.. you are spending all the time here and fighting with everyone.

if anyone starts talking about anything, you just come and start fighting.

Jet

Wonder full now EB2 is against H4 visa also beside BE3 ?

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:06 PM
Lets not denigrate all the H4's. I am sure our near and dear ones aren't vile as PlainSpeak.

Funny post though

Oh how considerate of you !!!
You think the same but dont say it out loud

gk_2000
04-15-2011, 10:10 PM
I can see why plainspeak had been banned in the past. I guess she oscillates between talking lot of sense to lot of nonsense. I will pass on this phase of hers :D

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 10:10 PM
Oh how considerate of you !!!
You think the same but dont say it out loud

Sorry if you misunderstood.

I have no sympathy for you

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:11 PM
All I want is for you to recognize, that what your argument may lead to, is that the F1 may be altered to be dual-intent, rather than invalidating the F1 to GC path. It is just a matter of perspective. You must be able to see the matter from other points of view

And let's try to avoid bashing other immigrants. Bring up points that help us all, or at least a majority of us. For example, I have an argument that The below INS law is impossible to implement.

USCIS - I-Link Reference (http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.f6da51a2342135be7e9d7a10e0dc91a0/?vgnextoid=fa7e539dc4bed010VgnVCM1000000ecd190aRCR D&vgnextchannel=fa7e539dc4bed010VgnVCM1000000ecd190a RCRD&CH=act)
NA: ACT 245 - ADJUSTMENT OF STATUS OF NONIMMIGRANT TO THAT OF PERSON ADMITTED FOR PERMANENT RESIDENCE

Sec. 245. [8 U.S.C. 1255]

(a) The status of an alien who was inspected and admitted or paroled into the United States 1/ or the status of any other alien having an approved petition for classification as a VAWA self-petitioner 1aa/ may be adjusted by the Attorney General, in his discretion and under such regulations as he may prescribe, to that of an alien lawfully admitted for permanent residence if


(1) the alien makes an application for such adjustment,


(2) the alien is eligible to receive an immigrant visa and is admissible to the United States for permanent residence, and


(3) an immigrant visa is immediately available to him at the time his application is filed.


It is impossible to carry out #3, because the numbers just aren't there to arrive at a definitive conclusion, that an immigrant visa is available to a person.

What arguments for or against this can you make?


Ok lets say that F1 is changed to a dual intent visa (Which i doubt will ever happen)
But lets say it happens then shouldn't they go to the end of the line
Is that not the same logic used by EB2 against EB3 Porters ?

What ever your logic the fact is currently F1 is NOT and immigrant intent visa and hence there is fraud currently. Now what happens in future is not deterministic but what is happening now is plain to see

gk_2000
04-15-2011, 10:16 PM
Ok lets say that F1 is changed to a dual intent visa (Which i doubt will ever happen)
But lets say it happens then shouldn't they go to the end of the line
Is that not the same logic used by EB2 against EB3 Porters ?

What ever your logic the fact is currently F1 is NOT and immigrant intent visa and hence there is fraud currently. Now what happens in future is not deterministic but what is happening now is plain to see

What US will do is also non-deterministic. To gauge it, you can only try to understand the sentiments currently running in politics. Anyway, if you look at the issue I am bringing up, it has the potential to grant everyone their freedom. But maybe I am talking to the wrong person, because you already have your EAD .. well your brains are also welcome in solving the puzzle

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:17 PM
Sorry if you misunderstood.

I have no sympathy for you

No actually i understood very clearly what you are. You have no sympathy because i disagree with you. Dont know if i should feel sorry or sad for you

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 10:18 PM
Ok lets say that F1 is changed to a dual intent visa (Which i doubt will ever happen)
But lets say it happens then shouldn't they go to the end of the line
Is that not the same logic used by EB2 against EB3 Porters ?

What ever your logic the fact is currently F1 is NOT and immigrant intent visa and hence there is fraud currently. Now what happens in future is not deterministic but what is happening now is plain to see

You should complain about this to USCIS

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 10:21 PM
No actually i understood very clearly what you are.

Yup likewise, though i will refrain from saying it openly in the forum :D

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:25 PM
What US will do is also non-deterministic. To gauge it, you can only try to understand the sentiments currently running in politics. Anyway, if you look at the issue I am bringing up, it has the potential to grant everyone their freedom. But maybe I am talking to the wrong person, because you already have your EAD .. well your brains are also welcome in solving the puzzle

US will do what US has to do for the benefit of US. Sentiments do not have any scope here and politics is well politics.

I disagree that there is any potential for freedom for everyone. You are short sighted and looking at a short term scenario. Things never go according to a plan trust an and you are asking me this plan when you yourselves cannot confirm if it will work for everyone.

Yes i have EAD but EB2 will get GC and i will still be stuck on EAD. So the bottom line is GC and in that EB2 has everything sewed up. Now why would EB2 need additional 50 K visas. They should be allocated from bottom to top approach

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:26 PM
You should complain about this to USCIS

I think some one already has talked to Grassely about it

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:26 PM
Yup likewise, though i will refrain from saying it openly in the forum :D

As your name suggests you will always be a boy never a man :D

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 10:33 PM
As your name suggests you will always be a boy never a man :D

Why? u looking for men..

jetflyer
04-15-2011, 10:35 PM
Why? u looking for men..

MC is available.

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:37 PM
Why? u looking for men..

And you call yourselves a US MS educated with that Trash mind and mouth of yours. Now why would US want to give preference to this sad specimen of man hood i will never understand

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:38 PM
MC is available.

Another US MS educated with trash mind and mouth

jetflyer
04-15-2011, 10:40 PM
Another US MS educated with trash mind and mouth

Oh man..you never insulted MC for his interest. I just said that he was interested.

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:43 PM
So typical of you guys. Once you lose an argument you start abusing and if the opponent is a female its more the merrier for you guys. Do you even know the basis rule of being polite with everyone in USA. So if the guy is an american you will kiss his feet. The moment the person is an indian you start abusing if it is an indian female then you have a licence to abuse

And these are the kinds of people who will get US citizenshiph

PlainSpeak
04-15-2011, 10:44 PM
Oh man..you never insulted MC for his interest. I just said that he was interested.

You sure you want to start this ???

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 10:52 PM
And you call yourselves a US MS educated with that Trash mind and mouth of yours. Now why would US want to give preference to this sad specimen of man hood i will never understand

Likewise my dear.

If you can be here why shouldn't I be??

belmontboy
04-15-2011, 10:55 PM
So typical of you guys. Once you lose an argument you start abusing and if the opponent is a female its more the merrier for you guys. Do you even know the basis rule of being polite with everyone in USA. So if the guy is an american you will kiss his feet. The moment the person is an indian you start abusing if it is an indian female then you have a licence to abuse

And these are the kinds of people who will get US citizenshiph

If you flip the pages you would know who started all these.

I did have some respect for your words though

bugsbunny
04-15-2011, 10:59 PM
Come on guys it's the weekend..relax and enjoy it
It's ok to let go of provocations
Life is unpredictable so relish every moment
Try yoga ...it works wonders for me :)

PlainSpeak
04-16-2011, 12:25 PM
If you flip the pages you would know who started all these.

I did have some respect for your words though

Yes please do flip through the pages and confirm. I stated what i felt MS education and EB2 qualification. No amount of study will take the place of experience. This is what i felt and i will not back down from your EB2 crowd to say that. Now your response was flaming and i responded back

Whether you have respect for me or not does not make any difference, the fact is i have lost all respect for your words.

PlainSpeak
04-16-2011, 12:29 PM
Come on guys it's the weekend..relax and enjoy it
It's ok to let go of provocations
Life is unpredictable so relish every moment
Try yoga ...it works wonders for me :)

Precisely my words life is unpredictable so what makes the EB2 guys so confident to say that once EB2 becomes current EB3 I will get spillover
Fact is .....
- EB2 will never become current
- Spillover will got to EBROW not EB3

So all these logic will go out of the window because life is unpredictable

belmontboy
04-16-2011, 12:39 PM
Whether you have respect for me or not does not make any difference, the fact is i have lost all respect for your words.

Does not make any difference :D

PlainSpeak
04-16-2011, 12:40 PM
Does not make any difference :D

M Feeling is K like wise L

belmontboy
04-16-2011, 12:43 PM
M Feeling is K like wise L

For sanity's sake, you win dear! i give up

PlainSpeak
04-16-2011, 12:46 PM
Fact is ...

As long as anyone here talks about EB3 porting fraud, EB1 Fraud, Desi consulting fraud what makes this (EB2 guys with MS) category a simon pure category. udent

Yes fraud is fraud and if someone talks about fraud and restricting fraud then it should be directed at all groups including F1 Student fraud

PlainSpeak
04-16-2011, 12:49 PM
For sanity's sake, you win dear! i give up

Well you never had any arguments points in the first place. All you had is a misplaced sense on self superiority.

But please don't run away from an argument try some logic for a change

belmontboy
04-16-2011, 12:52 PM
Well you never had any arguments points in the first place. All you had is a misplaced sense on self superiority.

But please don't run away from an argument try some logic for a change

can't argue with people who pretend not to understand.

Of millions of people only you say F1 is fraud. does a single person's opinion make it a fact?

Why don't u brush up your reasoning skills?

psagarn
04-16-2011, 01:19 PM
What exactly do you mean to do? Throw in your ideas and nothing will be spared...

I was watching TV the other day and saw an infomercial from National Association of Realtors promoting some kind of reform for home finance. They had interesting stats like "Home ownerships contributes ~ 2 trillion USD towards nation economy. So anything that promotes home ownership should help economy come out of recession". I am thinking if we can gather some useful stats around how much NRIs (non-GC holders from US) have invested in Indian Real Estate and how much of that could have been invested here in US (and other numbers like these), and then use them to convince those in power that an expedited GC process for those who want to be a part of main stream US resident population would help US economy.

PlainSpeak
04-16-2011, 04:22 PM
can't argue with people who pretend not to understand.

Of millions of people only you say F1 is fraud. does a sigle person's opinion make it a fact?

Why don't u brush up your reasoning skills?

Oh you will agree that i understand only if i agree with your point of view else you will cal me a person who pretends not to understand.

Where are the million people who say it is not a fraud. I dont see them. All i see is you and your EB2 crowd and what is their count 20 k, 30k ??

A single persons opinion is not a fact but this single person point of view is shared with a bunch of people who are more that 30 k so you dissing me does not make me wrong

PlainSpeak
04-16-2011, 04:26 PM
Plainspeak...no one here knows everything abt immigration. so its ok that u lost this argument. we are here to share out experiences, enlighten each other, and work for easing EB backlogs. The fact that theres no one in entire IV that supports ur argument should put some sense into you abt this issue.

and for everyone out there countering plain speak, know it will never end. i recently saw the sixth sense. the boy says 'they only believe what they want to believe'!

No one lost or won any argument here. Every side has stated their case. Please go ahead and believe what you want to believe but according to me belief is not something which waxes and wanes according to your supporters.'

Congrats on watching the sixth sense movie. Wow you are a big boy now. Before you start using that movie as an simile for what you are saying here, would you like me to explain what the movie was really about ...........

belmontboy
04-16-2011, 11:18 PM
Oh you will agree that i understand only if i agree with your point of view else you will cal me a person who pretends not to understand.

Where are the million people who say it is not a fraud. I dont see them. All i see is you and your EB2 crowd and what is their count 20 k, 30k ??

A single persons opinion is not a fact but this single person point of view is shared with a bunch of people who are more that 30 k so you dissing me does not make me wrong

Big yawn

You win lady. Be happy now

Goodintentions
04-16-2011, 11:38 PM
Dear All,

The idea behind this thread was to consider the option of a Time Bound Path for he beneift of the existing EB2 / EB3 folks who have filed Labour / I - 140 / 485.

I think the purpose of this thread is totally lost.

I am not sure how STEM or F1 or whatever should be a discussion here.

Anything we start here ends up in an acrimonious debate and many a time becomes very unpleasant and personal.

What are we all here for? Is it not our idea to to bring some relief to the EB immigrants?

Once again I request one and all to kindly refrain from unpleasant debates and think of working together for the welfare of the EB2 / EB3 community.

If we have our objectives clear and work towards a common goal, we sure can achieve success!

Kindly try to understand!!!

FraudGultee
04-17-2011, 10:07 AM
not a bad idea... but mind you they will be more for undocumented workers

senram
04-17-2011, 10:34 AM
This is a good idea. But tough to sell unless basic policy is changed. In USA any immigration has limit in numbers except a few category like spouses of US citizens. It is difficult to change that. When you put 8 years that means unlimited green cards. If they do that universities like TVU will be running full capacity and new universities will be started similar to that. Actually there should be some system to clean up univerity admission and also H1B so that genuine persons can come here easily.

Anyhow it is good idea to bring a bill like this and and see what happens. Still bills like recapture or modest rise of GC numbers will have a better chance of passing in congress


not a bad idea... but mind you they will be more for undocumented workers

JimmyJolly
04-17-2011, 04:33 PM
This is one of the more reasonable proposals heard here. To give it more credibility, I think we should add an earnings threshold to it. Something like 500K to 1 million in cumulative W-2 earnings. No matter what your country of birth or your educational qualification is, If you contributed significantly to this country and you are law abiding then you deserve a little respect so that you can do more of the same.

Michael chertoff
04-17-2011, 04:39 PM
This is one of the more reasonable proposals heard here. To give it more credibility, I think we should add an earnings threshold to it. Something like 500K to 1 million in cumulative W-2 earnings. No matter what your country of birth or your educational qualification is, If you contributed significantly to this country and you are law abiding then you deserve a little respect so that you can do more of the same.

Sir that will not go too far because it will be very easy for Desi body shoppers to generate W2s and pay stubs for that amount.


Make it simple. if someone working from last 10 years paying taxes and no crime history, never violated any law...Grant them Citizen ship...not GC.
MC